november 95


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From: Peter Bambang
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 02:09:15 +1000
Message-Id:

G'day,

I'm Peter Love otherwise known as Bambang...(from Java). This is my first
sending to you theThe addicts.

I live for the next two or so years in Canberra, OZ. I'm currently taking
a law degree combined with an bach of indonesian studies at ANU. My most
treasured theThe possession is his music, not any of the other
paraphenalia, just the sheer stark audio pleasure of theThe. (from all the
LPs I'd can't choose a favourite, 'cause they're all sooooo bloody
amazing.)

When not listening to theThe:
Hendrix "The Blues"
Neil Young
Leonard Cohen
Live
Smiths
Jeff Buckley

Yours,
Bambang

------------------------------
From: Douglas H Walker
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 11:57:28 CST
Message-Id: <9511131757.AA01725@pv343f.vincent.iastate.edu>

cc:
Subject:Re: I'm not a big enough man . . .
- --------
I've always been struck by the similarities of the lines:

"I've got too much energy to switch off my mind, but not enough to
get myself organized."

and

"I want to live, but I'm not a big enough man to do anything other
than think."

Any thoughts? Love to hear them.

-walker
------------------------------
From: 3dvideo@magi.com (Rob Ferguson)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 03:24:26 -0500
Message-Id: <9511290824.AA05973@magi.com>

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TOP TEN ALBUMS:


1. Closer - Joy Division
2. SUBSTANCE - Joy Division
3. New Gold Dream - Simple Minds
4. Never Mind the Bollocks - The Sex Pistols
5. Meat is Murder - The Smiths
6. Brotherhood - New Order
7. Andy Warhol - The Velvet Underground and Nico
8. Elvis Costello - Elvis Costello
9. Dead City Radio - William S. Burroughs
10. Dig the New Breed - The Jam

This is my pop collection, I could also add REM ,Wire, The Cure, Soft Cell, Kraftwerk, Sonic Youth, PIL, Japan, The Stranglers, Bauhaus, Peter Murphy U2, Janes Addiction etc, etc, etc. My rule is "if it ain't synth. it had better rock." I won't bother with my Blues list or my Jazz selections. The reason I was drawn to the The/Matt is odd though. I was an intreverted 18 year old listening to what was then a "Album" rock FM station in 1982. The Disc Jockey explained that the The was really a lone individual named Matt Johnson who played all the instruments and did all the production himself. At the time I was an amatuer athlete and I would buy cassettes to listen on my walkman while I trained on my cycling windload trainer or on my 15 km. runs. The more emotion a piece of music could elicit the harder I found I could push myself. Soul Mining was a great album to train too. Still I have stong images of looking down to my heartrate monitor beating away at 19o bpm while the sweat
dripped from me in time with "Perfect." Each following the The album seemed to be like someone was writing the soundtrack to my life, sadly so applicable. My favorite author is another outsider William S. but he is closely followed by Kurt Vonnegut Jr. My favorite director is
David Cronenburg closely followed by Tim Pope. Let's hope Tim can do something with the
Crow II as "the Crow" really sucked. I like Nirvana and Radio Head as well

P.S. Does that new Beatles Song and video really bite or is it just me?

3:36PM 11/28/95
- --=====================_817644067==_--
------------------------------
From: "Darren \"Dez\" Lightfoot"
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 18:04:59 +0000 (GMT)
Message-Id:

Spot on Pandora. I hate the way that these so called the The fans refer
to Matt being a group. And whilst I am on the subject of things that bug
me on this list, for al of you that cant spell it is 'the The' and not
'The The' or however you would like to put it.

DEZ

------------------------------
From: Ray Finlay
Sender: mrvf100@cus.cam.ac.uk (M.R.V. Finlay)
To: "Darren \"Dez\" Lightfoot"
cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: your mail
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 20:27:00 +0000 (GMT)
Message-ID:

On Fri, 3 Nov 1995, Darren "Dez" Lightfoot wrote:

> Spot on Pandora. I hate the way that these so called the The fans refer
> to Matt being a group. And whilst I am on the subject of things that bug
> me on this list, for al of you that cant spell it is 'the The' and not
> 'The The' or however you would like to put it.
>
> DEZ
>
>
>
do you mean for ALL of us that cant spell (dork)
Ray
------------------------------
From: "Darren \"Dez\" Lightfoot"
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 10:43:43 +0000 (GMT)
Message-Id:

checking mail
------------------------------
From: "Mr R. Forster"
To: ab956@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca (James Bykowy)
Cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Hanky Panky
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 09:02:18 +0000 (GMT)
Message-Id: <199511010902.JAA05919@uxa.liv.ac.uk>

I would tend to agree, it has not grown on me, like all the rest, it just
does'nt hit me, I have tried to like it, but its a no win situation, I think
it would have been better if he would have kept it to a EP, rather than a
full player, I remember the NME review of Hanky Panky, it mentioned that,
after Dusk, Hanky Panky was a let down, as Matt had such a talent he did not
need to record covers,the one good thing about it, is that we can hear where
Matt is coming from.



In the last mail James Bykowy said:
>
>
>
> > I am relatively new to this list and so I don't know whether it has been
> > discussed before, but can anyone out there get their head around this album?
> > What is going on! Crap or what. I, for one, am not interested in hearing
> > Matt indulge his ridiculous penchant for Hank Williams, especially after
> > parting with my hard-earned cash (cash anyway) for the privilege. I
> > sincerely hope he/they never pull another stunt like that. Comments?
>
> Y'know, it usually takes me a while to get used to each album of his.
> They all tend to grow on me. the only one I instantly liked was Soul
> Mining. I tell ya, Mind Bomb took a while to get my head around, but I
> love it like the rest now. So I'm expecting this will be the continued
> trend with HP, however, I must admit that the album's premise has me at a
> disadvantage. I'm not much for Hank Williams.
>
> The thing I *REALLY* wonder about is this rumoured album of hymns he's
> planning to do? I may have to stretch my appreciation of the man to
> enjoy that album, but time will tell.
>
> James Bykowy
>
>
> "Thirty days has September, October, June, and February...
> All the rest have thirty-one, except my brother,
> Who got six months."
> - Peter Sellers as "Hrundi V. Bakshi", The Party
>
>
>
>
------------------------------
From: Graham Moore
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Hanky Panky
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 10:18:22 +0000 (GMT)
Message-ID: <9511011023.aa01515@scott.sco.com>


I though Hanky Panky was excellent and very brave. In this day and age that
everyone covers everyone else I thought Matt made Hank's music modern and
refreshing in a country and western sort of way.

Graham

>From scol.london.sco.com!sco.sco.com!cs.cs.uchicago.edu!cs.uchicago.edu!behfar Wed Nov 1 09:47:32 1995
>From: "Mr R. Forster"
>Message-Id: <199511010902.JAA05919@uxa.liv.ac.uk>
>Subject: Re: Hanky Panky
>To: James Bykowy
>Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 09:02:18 +0000 (GMT)
>Cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
>In-Reply-To: from "James Bykowy" at Oct 30, 95 11:16:07 pm
>X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23]
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>I would tend to agree, it has not grown on me, like all the rest, it just
>does'nt hit me, I have tried to like it, but its a no win situation, I think
>it would have been better if he would have kept it to a EP, rather than a
>full player, I remember the NME review of Hanky Panky, it mentioned that,
>after Dusk, Hanky Panky was a let down, as Matt had such a talent he did not
>need to record covers,the one good thing about it, is that we can hear where
>Matt is coming from.



>In the last mail James Bykowy said:
>>
>>
>>
>> > I am relatively new to this list and so I don't know whether it has been
>> > discussed before, but can anyone out there get their head around this album?
>> > What is going on! Crap or what. I, for one, am not interested in hearing
>> > Matt indulge his ridiculous penchant for Hank Williams, especially after
>> > parting with my hard-earned cash (cash anyway) for the privilege. I
>> > sincerely hope he/they never pull another stunt like that. Comments?
>>
>> Y'know, it usually takes me a while to get used to each album of his.
>> They all tend to grow on me. the only one I instantly liked was Soul
>> Mining. I tell ya, Mind Bomb took a while to get my head around, but I
>> love it like the rest now. So I'm expecting this will be the continued
>> trend with HP, however, I must admit that the album's premise has me at a
>> disadvantage. I'm not much for Hank Williams.
>>
>> The thing I *REALLY* wonder about is this rumoured album of hymns he's
>> planning to do? I may have to stretch my appreciation of the man to
>> enjoy that album, but time will tell.
>>
>> James Bykowy
>>
>>
>> "Thirty days has September, October, June, and February...
>> All the rest have thirty-one, except my brother,
>> Who got six months."
>> - Peter Sellers as "Hrundi V. Bakshi", The Party
>>
>>
>>
>>
------------------------------
From: Steven W Hill
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: New HTML Discography (almost)!
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 95 9:57:10 CST
Message-Id: <9511011557.AA28302@harper.cc.il.us>

> Everyone, I'm working on a major update to version 2.0 of the discography
> in both text and HTML versions. Hopefully it will be done within a couple
> of days. Keep watching here!

Well, I worked on this for SIX HOURS last night.
It's not done yet. BUT you can see how it's coming along! Be aware that
it is quite graphics intensive although I've tried to make the images
"built for speed". Give me feedback!

http://www.idis.com/shill/tt/thethe20.htm

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ go for it.
-shill

- --
[][] [][] Steve Hill, Network Communications Specialist, 708-925-6273
[] [] [] Harper College, 1200 W Algonquin Rd, Palatine IL 60067-7398
----shill@harper.cc.il.us----http://www.harper.cc.il.us----
[] [] [] "Mostly harmless."
[][] [][] personal:(http://www.idis.com/shill/index.htm)
------------------------------
From: Steven W Hill
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: New HTML Discography (almost)!
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 95 14:53:08 CST
Message-Id: <9511012053.AA02819@harper.cc.il.us>

> Well, I worked on this for SIX HOURS last night.
> It's not done yet. BUT you can see how it's coming along! Be aware that
> it is quite graphics intensive although I've tried to make the images
> "built for speed". Give me feedback!
>
> http://www.idis.com/shill/tt/thethe20.htm
>
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ go for it.

I should point out that it uses a lot of jpeg images and probably uses a
few Netscape-specific proprietary non-real-HTML tags, so I would
recommend using Netscape. Also if you don't see all the images, you might
need to increase your Netscape cache.

- --
[][] [][] Steve Hill, Network Communications Specialist, 708-925-6273
[] [] [] Harper College, 1200 W Algonquin Rd, Palatine IL 60067-7398
----shill@harper.cc.il.us----http://www.harper.cc.il.us----
[] [] [] "Lousy Smarch weather!"
[][] [][] personal:(http://www.idis.com/shill/index.htm)
------------------------------
From: djelline@haverford.edu (David M. Jellinek)
To: Steven W Hill , infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: New HTML Discography (almost)!
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 20:51:37 -0500
Message-Id:

I'm impressed with all the work you've put into this, but I can't see it!
I have tried to access the web page and I get a 404 error--its not there!
Anyone else? Success or failure?

Dave

- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The vice of our times indeed appears to be that nothing is so firm as that
it could not be uprooted, nothing so certain that it could not be disputed,
and nothing so sacred that it could not be violated."

Philippe Duplessis-Mornay, 1579


David Jellinek
djelline@haverford.edu
610-642-5511

------------------------------
From: Steven W Hill
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: New The The Discography
Date: Thu, 2 Nov 95 9:35:21 CST
Message-Id: <9511021535.AA18418@harper.cc.il.us>

> I'm impressed with all the work you've put into this, but I can't see it!
> I have tried to access the web page and I get a 404 error--its not there!
> Anyone else? Success or failure?

Try again, and if you can cut & paste this address, all the better:

http:///www.idis.com/shill/tt/thethe20.htm

^^^^
note this is HTM not HTML

I've received almost ZERO feedback. Hope I get more.
- -shill

- --
[][] [][] Steve Hill, Network Communications Specialist, 708-925-6273
[] [] [] Harper College, 1200 W Algonquin Rd, Palatine IL 60067-7398
----shill@harper.cc.il.us----http://www.harper.cc.il.us----
[] [] [] "Lousy Smarch weather!"
[][] [][] personal:(http://www.idis.com/shill/index.htm)
------------------------------
From: John Jenkins
To: "'infected@cs.uchicago.edu'"
Subject: RE: New The The Discography
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 02:26:51 -0330
Message-Id: <01BAA994.DCAA1D20@newcd39.newcomm.net>

Hi Steve,

The web site is excellent! I've added it to my 'favourite places' under =
Entertainment/Music... You have three slashes following the 'http' in =
the URL you have listed below, which may cause problems for some.

One other note, I have a double compilation album of dance tracks which =
includes a remixed 'Perfect'. I think it's called 'Can't Stop Dancing' =
or something profound like that. I'd always thought that it's version =
was the real version of 'Perfect', until of course I heard the real =
version...

If you'd like more info let me know.

Is it still possible to purchase the 'Uncertain Smile' 12"?

- ----------
From: Steven W Hill[SMTP:shill@harper.cc.il.us]
Sent: Thursday, November 02, 1995 12:05 PM
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: New The The Discography

> I'm impressed with all the work you've put into this, but I can't see =
it!
> I have tried to access the web page and I get a 404 error--its not =
there!
> Anyone else? Success or failure?

Try again, and if you can cut & paste this address, all the better:

http:///www.idis.com/shill/tt/thethe20.htm

^^^^
note this is HTM not HTML

I've received almost ZERO feedback. Hope I get more.
- -shill

- --
[][] [][] Steve Hill, Network Communications Specialist, 708-925-6273
[] [] [] Harper College, 1200 W Algonquin Rd, Palatine IL 60067-7398
----shill@harper.cc.il.us----http://www.harper.cc.il.us----
[] [] [] "Lousy Smarch weather!"
[][] [][] personal:(http://www.idis.com/shill/index.htm)


------------------------------
From: dougcha
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Cc: shill@harper.cc.il.us
Subject: Re: New The The Discography
Date: Thu, 2 Nov 95 16:55:30 PST
Message-Id: <9511030120.AA12330@netmail2.microsoft.com>

I had some trouble getting on (just the generic "the computer on which
it is located reported an error"), but I kept trying, and I eventually
connected.

Very Cool! I like having the pictures of the album covers. This will
make them easier to spot when I'm digging through piles of used LPs. A
couple additions / suggestions:

1 I just picked up another 12" single of infected the other day. It
contains Infected (Extended Mix), Infected (Skull Crusher Mix), and
Infected (Energy Mix). It has the cardboard sleeve with the white
paper liner (as opposed to the printed paper sleeve), and "Infected" is
pink, while "The The" is blue (opposite of the one on the discography).
Anybody heard of this one? It looks like a re-release (cardboard
sleeve, generic Epic sticker in center of disk, instead of "The The
logo" sticker).

2 "Alive" interview / live disk.

3 Are you planning on having larger images of more of the album covers
available?

But overall, excellent work!! Thanks.

- -Doug



- ----------
>From: Steven W Hill

>
>I've received almost ZERO feedback. Hope I get more.
>-shill
>

------------------------------
From: Behfar Bastani-Booshehri
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: New The The Discography
Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 23:21:19 -0600 (CST)
Message-Id: <199511030521.XAA09174@gargoyle.cs.uchicago.edu>

dougcha@microsoft.com writes:
> 1 I just picked up another 12" single of infected the other day. It
> contains Infected (Extended Mix), Infected (Skull Crusher Mix), and
> Infected (Energy Mix). It has the cardboard sleeve with the white
> paper liner (as opposed to the printed paper sleeve), and "Infected" is
> pink, while "The The" is blue (opposite of the one on the discography).
> Anybody heard of this one?

yes, i picked up this one a year ago too.
don't know if it's a re-release.

behfar
------------------------------
From: Steven W Hill
To: behfar@cs.uchicago.edu
Cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: New The The Discography
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 95 3:37:00 CST
Message-Id: <9511030937.AA06162@harper.cc.il.us>

> dougcha@microsoft.com writes:
> > 1 I just picked up another 12" single of infected the other day. It
> > contains Infected (Extended Mix), Infected (Skull Crusher Mix), and
> > Infected (Energy Mix). It has the cardboard sleeve with the white
> > paper liner (as opposed to the printed paper sleeve), and "Infected" is
> > pink, while "The The" is blue (opposite of the one on the discography).
> > Anybody heard of this one?

Sounds like the US release.
- -shill

- --
[][] [][] Steve Hill, Network Communications Specialist, 708-925-6273
[] [] [] Harper College, 1200 W Algonquin Rd, Palatine IL 60067-7398
----shill@harper.cc.il.us----http://www.harper.cc.il.us----
[] [] [] "Lousy Smarch weather!"
[][] [][] personal:(http://www.idis.com/shill/index.htm)
------------------------------
From: Jeff Croft
To: "David M. Jellinek"
cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: New HTML Discography (almost)!
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 1995 18:57:15 -0700 (MST)
Message-ID:



On Wed, 1 Nov 1995, David M. Jellinek wrote:

> I'm impressed with all the work you've put into this, but I can't see it!
> I have tried to access the web page and I get a 404 error--its not there!
> Anyone else? Success or failure?

I tried it today and it worked...

Jeff
jdcroft@eng.utah.edu
------------------------------
From: John Jenkins
To: "'infected@cs.uchicago.edu'"
Subject: Discussion Time/First Purchase
Date: Thu, 2 Nov 1995 00:05:56 -0330
Message-Id: <01BAA8B7.9EEB1D00@newcd22.newcomm.net>

Hi all,

I'm currently living on a construction camp in Bull Arm, Newfoundland, =
about an hour and a half (at 100km/hr) outside of St. John's, the =
capital. Permanent residence is St. Philip's, a rural outpost near St. =
John's.

I'm classified as a Systems Engineer, which involves software =
development, network maintenance, and everything in between.

In the precious spare time I have, I like to play with my kids, ages 4 =
and 2... (Gee, I must be the oldest one here?) Sometimes I manage to =
half-finish home improvement projects; other times I'm not so lucky... =
Fine woodworking, restoring and refinishing, and writing, are among my =
hobbies.

Favourite The The possession? An old recording of the extended version =
of "Uncertain Smile" I taped off a show called "Brave New Waves", what =
seems like eons ago. First The The song I ever heard. The version with =
the flute instead of the piano. I'd kill for a CD copy of it.

Other favourite artists include Tom Waits, Gang of Four, Underworld, =
Legendary Pink Dots, Julian Cope, Midnight Oil, Enya, The Church, Marty =
Willson-Piper, World Party, the Nits, and many many more that I can't =
think of right now.

I think Hanky Panky was a brilliant execution of a excellent idea. I =
always knew Hank Williams was a master at his craft but I certainly =
didn't appreciate how much; his double greatest hits will soon sit =
beside Jim Reeves and Patsy Cline in our CD collection.

I was speaking with a co-worker today about music, and we were talking =
about our first record purchases; mine was "One of These Nights" by the =
Eagles, when I was about ten years old... He told me, somewhat =
embarassed, that his was Michael Jackson's "Thriller". These co-op =
students make me feel sooo old... Anyone else like to relate his/her =
first purchase?

Regards...
- ------------------
John Jenkins
PKS/MOF - Hibernia
- ------------------
------------------------------
From: Scot R Stanfield
To: "'infected@cs.uchicago.edu'"
Subject: RE: Discussion Time/First Purchase
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 07:44:18 -0700
Message-Id: <01BAAC1B.B62B5EA0@cgyr1.ccinet.ab.ca>



- ----------
From: pandora@getnet.com[SMTP:pandora@getnet.com]
Sent: Thursday, November 02, 1995 10:33 PM

Anyone else like to relate his/her first purchase?

Yikes! Time to reach into the mists of time... In my neigborhood as a =
kid we had a strip mall that has the suburbian grocery store, 7-11, drug =
store, bank, etc.. One day, I was tearing around in there, trying to =
give the security guard a stroke when I noticed a SMALL record store had =
(futilely) decided to make a go of it. A quick trip home to beg for =
money was all the time I wasted and even in retrospect I figure I batted =
a good .667 my first time out:

the Beatles - Sgt. Pepper (I'd wanted the White Album 'cause I'd heard =
Rocky Racoon somewhere but he didn't have it)

the Police - Zenyatta Mondatta (I have no idea why)

and the great clunker: Hall & Oates - H2O

All in all, not bad for whenever it was (I think the latter two were =
new). Now what happened to my 900+ LP collection years later is another =
story altogether (I'll never stop missing my first pressing BBS, or my =
Bela Lugosi's Dead picture disc, or the Icicle Works first album, or =
my...) ....
Scot

------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Discussion Time/First Purchase
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 05:33:03 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511031233.FAA26044@getnet.com>


>I was speaking with a co-worker today about music, and we were talking
about our first record purchases; mine was "One of These Nights" by the
Eagles, when I was about ten years old... He told me, somewhat embarassed,
that his was Michael Jackson's "Thriller". These co-op students make me
feel sooo old... Anyone else like to relate his/her first purchase?

Duran Duran's Rio, and Tears For Fears "Songs from the Big Chair." -
also my first introduction to the lovely world of record club membership -
eech! Still damn fine albums, I think, so not too embarrassing. (unless
you count the Amy Grant?!? tape I bought when I was 13 - I don't. That
would be pretty embarrassing!)

Jenna
------------------------------
From: sandman
To: pandora@getnet.com
Cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Discussion Time/First Purchase
Date: Sat, 4 Nov 1995 21:46:35 -0800 (PST)
Message-Id:



On Fri, 3 Nov 1995 pandora@getnet.com wrote:

>
> >I was speaking with a co-worker today about music, and we were talking
> about our first record purchases; mine was "One of These Nights" by the
> Eagles, when I was about ten years old... He told me, somewhat embarassed,
> that his was Michael Jackson's "Thriller". These co-op students make me
> feel sooo old... Anyone else like to relate his/her first purchase?

HEY!!!

And a hardy Boy-Howdy to all!! I'm gonna use this posting to answer
the other set o' questions also. I'm a 29 year old dude from Bellingham,
Wa. U.S.A. I'm a student and i work in the happy world of music retail
and am also a help line operator. (i try to make sure thethe aren't
playing in the background when calls come in.) My fave thethe thing i own
is Mind Bomb (and Dusk). my rarest is thethe vs. the world interview &
music disc.
My first rock music puchase was at the ripe old age of 13. It was
Blondie's Atomic 12" and the album Eat to the Beat.
sorry if this has been a soozer for y'all, but somebody somewhere asked.



PEACE,
jb
------------------------------
From: Superfly TNT
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Discussion Time/First Purchase
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 00:58:08 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id:


my first music purchase was at the age of 12 when I got one of those two
albums on one cassette deals... it was _Outlandos D'Amour_ and _Regatta
De Blanc_ by The Police... they were my favorite band until I discovered
_Soul Mining_ three years later (along with The Cure's "Pornography" and
The Smith's "Meat is Murder")... does this make me one of the older
persons on this list?... anyways, I feel old...

on another note, I just purchased _Cold Spell Ahead_ ($3.99 at a used CD
store; and that's in Canadian funds too!)... I've already heard the two
tracks on the CD from my the The compilation tapes (courtesy of a fellow
infectant) but I'm happy I got the real thing... there's a half-naked,
funky chick with big hair on the cover and on the back of the CD, it says
"Bag by Andy Johnson"... haha...

lastly, someone on the list said to check out the Geraldine Fibbers... I
concur!!... check 'em out... it features Carla Bozulich (sp?) on guitar
and vocals... some of you may know her as the husky and gravel-ly female
voice on a bunch of tracks of Mike Watt's _Ballhog or Tugboat_... Their
album is called _Somewhere between the Earth and my Home_ and lyrically, it's
incredible!... the violin is great too!...

Yan


"Don't knock masturbation, it's sex with someone I love."

- Woody Allen (Annie Hall)
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Discussion Time/First Purchase
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 07:23:13 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511051423.HAA17452@getnet.com>

>
>
>On Fri, 3 Nov 1995 pandora@getnet.com wrote:
>
>>
>> >I was speaking with a co-worker today about music, and we were talking
>> about our first record purchases; mine was "One of These Nights" by the
>> Eagles, when I was about ten years old... He told me, somewhat embarassed,
>> that his was Michael Jackson's "Thriller". These co-op students make me
>> feel sooo old... Anyone else like to relate his/her first purchase?

No, I didn't write, I just quoted.
------------------------------
From: sjsmith@mail.os2bbs.com (Stephen J. Smith)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Discussion Time/First Purchase
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 95 21:39:11 EST
Message-Id: <9511070136.AA8332@bbs.os2bbs.com>

On Sun, 5 Nov 1995 00:58:08 -0700 (MST) you wrote:
>
>lastly, someone on the list said to check out the Geraldine Fibbers... I
>concur!!... check 'em out... it features Carla Bozulich (sp?) on guitar
>and vocals... some of you may know her as the husky and gravel-ly female
>voice on a bunch of tracks of Mike Watt's _Ballhog or Tugboat_... Their
>album is called _Somewhere between the Earth and my Home_ and lyrically, it's
>incredible!... the violin is great too!...
>

I've been wondering about the Geraldine Fibbers... I saw their video
and thought the singer sounded like Carla Bozulich... thanks for the
info! (She was part of Ethyl Meatplow. Their "Happy Days,
Sweetheart" is one of my favorites from '93.)
------------------------------
From: Jeff Croft
To: "Stephen J. Smith"
cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Discussion Time/First Purchase
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 01:08:18 -0700 (MST)
Message-ID:



On Mon, 6 Nov 1995, Stephen J. Smith wrote:

> >lastly, someone on the list said to check out the Geraldine Fibbers... I
> >concur!!... check 'em out... it features Carla Bozulich (sp?) on guitar
> >and vocals... some of you may know her as the husky and gravel-ly female
> >voice on a bunch of tracks of Mike Watt's _Ballhog or Tugboat_... Their
> >album is called _Somewhere between the Earth and my Home_ and lyrically, it's
> >incredible!... the violin is great too!...
> >
>
> I've been wondering about the Geraldine Fibbers... I saw their video
> and thought the singer sounded like Carla Bozulich... thanks for the
> info! (She was part of Ethyl Meatplow. Their "Happy Days,
> Sweetheart" is one of my favorites from '93.)

I really got into Ethyl Meatplow for a while. I saw them with Front 242.
I went to see Front 242 but I ended up liking the Ethyl Meatplow part of
the show much more.

Jeff
jdcroft@eng.utah.edu
------------------------------
From: marice@students.wisc.edu (elvis)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Discussion Time/First Purchase
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 11:52:23 +0700
Message-Id:

>>
>>
>>On Fri, 3 Nov 1995 pandora@getnet.com wrote:
>>
>>>
Anyone else like to relate his/her first purchase?
>
>No, I didn't write, I just quoted.

who cares anyways
um...my first purchases were really lame, but my first concerts were cool
and the gang and Johnny Denver.....can i be cool now?
- -elvis

------------------------------
From: robbd@vyger.enet.dec.com
To: "infected@cs.uchicago.edu"@vbormc.vbo.dec.com
Cc: robbd@vyger.enet.dec.com
Subject: Rare CDs - anyone interested?
Date: Thu, 2 Nov 95 17:48:33 MET
Message-Id: <199511021643.RAA11824@vbormc.vbo.dec.com>


For a very short time, I'm in a position to help folks out who are
looking for copies of the following rare European 'live' disks :-

"Save Me" (live '93)
"The Intimate Stranger" (live '90)
"Brixton Academy" (live'93)

The bad news is that the price of each title is somewhere between
$25 and $30, but if I may be able to negotiate if there is sufficient
demand.

Those who are definately interested should send me e-mail direct in
the first instance.

"I'm just another Western guy ..."

- - Dougie
------------------------------
From: bickertonj@mozart.which.co.uk (Defeatist)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Ejaculating devil
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 11:19:44 +0100
Message-Id: <95110311194434@mozart.which.co.uk>

This was in fact the original cover for the Infected single. Painted by Andy
Dog it was a darn fine "shocking" depiction of the devil masterbating.
However the powers that be were not altogether keen on it and so the edited
picture appeared as the single cover. Some covers did get released and you can
find them (if you're lucky, such as myself) selling for #10-#15. Actually I got
mine for #2.50 not including the record from a wholesale distributer who must
have found a load at the back of a warehouse or something.
Also, on the Mind Bomb tour they sold T-shirts with the same picture on, havn't
seen the T-shirts since.
Jake.
------------------------------
From: Genepool@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Ejaculating devil
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 14:39:09 -0500
Message-ID: <951103143909_80653323@mail04.mail.aol.com>

Actually, i was going to put this as my prized possesion. I have this 12"
too. I could see how the record company might object, slightly. ;)
While I'm at it, I will respond to the "who are we" thread.
Other Stats:

Residence: Northern NJ,USA

Job that pays:
Service Manager at a BMW dealer

Job that doesn't pay:
Vocalist and guitarist for the band genepool. We play in the NYC/NJ area. Our
last show was at CBGB's

Bands I like: My Bloody Valentine, Foo Fighters, Verve, Curve, Cure, Bill
Nelson, Eno, David Sylvian, Meat Beat Manifesto, Talk Talk, AIC, Butthole
Surfers, Elastica, Tindersticks, Residents, Wolfgang Press etc etc.

Hobbies:
Snowboard, Scuba

Birth Sign:
Just kidding

Steve
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: RE: 4 questions
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 03:42:41 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511031042.DAA21017@getnet.com>


>hold on... your Dis-infected EP has the remix of _Violence of Truth_?...
>mine doesn't... unless there is a UK and US version... I bought mine new
>for $10 up here in Canada which is the going price for an EP so it
>couldn't have been an import... can anyone shed any light on this?...

There is also a Japanese version of DisInfected, which is different than the
US or UK versions - it doesn't have VOT, but does have 'scenes from
arctic twilight'.....
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: A Scenario
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 03:50:07 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511031050.DAA21329@getnet.com>

Hey there! It's so great to see the volume of email pick up dramatically over
the last two weeks....have a lot more people signed on to the list? I tried
forever to get the conversation going and finally gave up, so it's good to
see that it's regenerated itself. Unfortunately I haven't been online much,
so I'm way behind.....please please bear with me as I plod through and respond
to what looks like a lot of great posts, I don't want to miss out on any of the
discussion, past or present.


>Here you are, at MJ's very own Infected Mind's Saloon. You're mateless; as
>you scan the bar, you realize that you are gripped by the 3 L's (lost,
>lonely...). You approach an attractive/intense number and begin dialogue with
>an appropriate qoute. . .
>
>************What would it be. . .please remember the setting.**************
>
>My example: "I've been watching you for ages. You're like a boat without a
>mast. Struggling with the tide of destiny. Between the future and the past."
>Pretty suave ehh! Wish I'd said it.


How about ---

"You're the strangest feeling, I've ever had."

or -

"I've got you under my skin where the rain can't get in"

or even --

"I've been dying of a thirst for your company."


Great scenario - wish I'd though of it!!!

Jenna
------------------------------
From: Robert Forster
To: pandora@getnet.com
cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: A Scenario
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 10:16:32 GMT
Message-ID:


On Fri, 3 Nov 1995 03:50:07 -0700 (MST) pandora@getnet.com wrote:

> From: pandora@getnet.com> Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 03:50:07 -0700 (MST)
> Subject: Re: A Scenario
> To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
>
> Hey there! It's so great to see the volume of email pick up dramatically over
> the last two weeks....have a lot more people signed on to the list? I tried
> forever to get the conversation going and finally gave up, so it's good to
> see that it's regenerated itself. Unfortunately I haven't been online much,
> so I'm way behind.....please please bear with me as I plod through and respond
> to what looks like a lot of great posts, I don't want to miss out on any of the
> discussion, past or present.
>
>
> >Here you are, at MJ's very own Infected Mind's Saloon. You're mateless; as
> >you scan the bar, you realize that you are gripped by the 3 L's (lost,
> >lonely...). You approach an attractive/intense number and begin dialogue with
> >an appropriate qoute. . .
> >
> >************What would it be. . .please remember the setting.**************
> >

>
> How about ---
>
>I'll take you to the angels if you take me to myself....

(what a line!!!)
>

>
>
>
>


------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: RE: discussion time...
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 03:58:25 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511031058.DAA21661@getnet.com>


>3. Hobbies: Music, backpacking, Guiness, masterbation

>David Cooper

That's masturbation, and Dave.....I think it's everyone's hobby....they
just won't admit, that's all.


------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: RE: discussion time...
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 04:08:48 -0701 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511031109.EAA22116@getnet.com>

My Fave TheThe possession is a Infected tour tee shirt autographed to me by
all the Mind Bomb-era band members. I won a radio
> contest (fluke) and got to meet them all before the show. Matt was kinda
bummed out- I think his brother had just died. Johnny let me play his guitar
and taught me much about being a "musician" instead of an Egomaniacal guitar
player.

Lucky you! I bet a lot of people on the list are envying you. I would (well not
literally) KILL for such an opportunity..... I didn't know that Matt's
brother had
died....was that Andy Johnson, the one that does the cover art? How sad in
any case.

It was way back then, but I remember it every time I see that shirt with
the ejaculating devil.
>

?????? ejaculating devil? What is that from.... a specific album or concert...?
I'm unaware of this. Tell me more.
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: discussion time...
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 04:44:05 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511031144.EAA23812@getnet.com>


>Well, hello.
>
>This list has been kinda slow again recently,
>so I thought (even after being warned not to) that I would
>try and get something going.

Actually it seems as if you have succeeded. I guess everybody
likes to talk about themselves. Congratulations, I've tried this
many times before and failed or only partially succeeded.

Everyone try and answer the following
>questions:
>
>1) Where (city, state) do you live?

Phoenix, AZ (but hoping to get out soon!)

>2) What is your profession (student, bum, prostitute, computer programer,
>etc)?

All of the above, plus nanny, mom, photographer.....

>3) Hobbies?

See above, plus spending way too much time on the Internet, outdoor
stuff like climbing and camping, listening to music, reading, etc...

>4) Favorite "the The" possesion, and why?

Well, I hate to be lame but Soul Mining would have to be it (as in,
if I could only keep one the The thing, that would be it), Except
I don't know where my CD is, I seemed to have "misplaced" it
(not my only copy of it, of course!)

I am quite excited, however, by a load of the The stuff I got
from another online "the The friend" including videos and
tapes of song rarites.

Since others have discussed their other favorites, I'll list
mine here: (in no particular order)

This Mortal Coil, Dead Can Dance, The Pixies, Sisters of Mercy,
Mission UK, Smashing Pumpkins, Tori Amos, Garbage (just got
into them), Spacemen 3, The Call, Peter Murphy, Soundgarden
Bauhaus, Book of Love, The Indigo Girls, 10,000 Maniacs, Violent
Femmes, Cat Stevens, The Cult, My Life With The Thrill Kill Cult,
The Doors, The Beatles, The Moody Blues, Crowded House,
Front 242, Love and Rockets, The Wonderstuff, Modern English,
Erasure, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Joy Division, New Order, NIN,
Echo, Siouxsie, Oingo Boingo, Portishead....
(geez, am I eclectic, or what???) I'm also partial to Mozart, Bach,
Rossini, Vivaldi, Orff, Prokofiev, Liszt, etc.

(and of course, the obvious ones like TheCureDepcheModeTheSmiths
REMU2NirvanaPearlJam)

but basically the The is my favorite, the one I'm obsessed with....
I haven't felt that way about a band since I was 16, with the Cure.

Jenna
------------------------------
From: Graham Moore
To: pandora@getnet.com, infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: RE: discussion time...
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 11:42:57 +0000 (GMT)
Message-ID: <9511031147.aa07834@scott.sco.com>


>From: pandora@getnet.com
>Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 04:08:48 -0701 (MST)
>To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
>Subject: RE: discussion time...

>My Fave TheThe possession is a Infected tour tee shirt autographed to me by
>all the Mind Bomb-era band members. I won a radio
>> contest (fluke) and got to meet them all before the show. Matt was kinda
>bummed out- I think his brother had just died. Johnny let me play his guitar
>and taught me much about being a "musician" instead of an Egomaniacal guitar
>player.

>Lucky you! I bet a lot of people on the list are envying you. I would (well not
>literally) KILL for such an opportunity..... I didn't know that Matt's
>brother had
>died....was that Andy Johnson, the one that does the cover art? How sad in
>any case.

> It was way back then, but I remember it every time I see that shirt with
>the ejaculating devil.
>>

>?????? ejaculating devil? What is that from.... a specific album or concert...?
>I'm unaware of this. Tell me more.

One of the projections used at the Royal Albert Hall concert in July 1990
was of a masturbating devil.

Graham
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Favorite lyrics...
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 06:02:27 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511031302.GAA27443@getnet.com>

"One day I asked the angels for inspiration, the devil bought me a drink...
he's been buying them, ever since."

"Down by the river, I'll be washing out my mouth, cause deep in the
heart of me is a frightened man who's reaching out. Oh I'm just
looking for paradise, anywhere in this world. I'll be gunning for
heaven in this man made hell..."

"If you think that Jesus Christ is coming, honey you've got
another think coming
If he ever finds out, who's hijacked his name, he'll cut out his
heart, and turn in his grave."

"I followed that bead of sweat, to the small of the back
from the nape of your neck, lighting it up, with every drag
upon my, cigarette" (bamp!)

"In this bed, between these sheets, take me to a happiness
beyond human reach...."

"Oh what a perfect daaaaayyyyy....to think about myself.
My feet are firmly nailed to the floor, what it there to fear
from such a regular world?"

"How can anyone, know me, when I don't even know mysehh eh elf?"

and, when I'm feeling wicked -

"I was feeling strong mouthed and weak willed,
when I ran into the cure, for my ills...
Don't tell me what your name is,
I want your body, not your mind
I want a feeling, worth paying for,
before I say goodniiiight.
As I was talking, I couldn't look her in the eye
I just kept wondering, how many men had
unleashed their frustration between her thighs.." :-o

and of course, my all time fave:

"I'm just a symptom of the moral decay that's gnawing at
the heart of this cou uh uh ntry."

The best thing about all these lyrics is, though, is the way
that Matt sings them....writing these down I can here
the way he draws out certain words....it just makes it
all the more delicious!

(believe it or not, that was all straight from memory. Good
thing I didn't have the lyrics in front of me or I'd be even more
out of control! Sorry for the long post, but these lyrics, and
the rest of them, just mean so much to me.....)
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Long post.SEX, oh my and more SEX and SEXUALITY, geesh quit shouting, my ears ;p
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 06:27:22 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511031327.GAA28738@getnet.com>



>So what does Matt write about, just what i described, that total paradox of
>knowing what you should do and then not doing it. He writes about the
>desparation of knowing that you're nothing more than a sexual appetite to be
>fed, "She was lying ther like a stuck pig...(not good at exact quotes but
>hopefully y'a;; get the idea)".

It's "She was lying on her back with her legs parted, squealing like
a stuck pig." from Out of the Blue, one of my favorite the The songs.
(I probably have the whole thing memorized, I bet!)
At first appearance total raunch, but really it's about anesthetizing yourself
through sex. "I ran into a cure, for my ills" "I thought if I acted like
someone else, I'd feel more comfortable with myself, yeah."
We had a great discussion about it here a few months ago.

He sings about the loneliness of being right
>next to someone but light years away, Kingdom of Rain. He writes about the
>emotional gravitation towards someone, Gravitate to Me.
>
>He sings about my life actually, and all those crazy mixed-up emotions that
>have no place to go sometimes. He writes about the depraved and the deprived
>and everything in between; the bonds and the fragments, the obsession and the
>less-than-savory seedy world of sex.

That's what I lurve about him....his absolute honesty about sex (and life, for
that matter) Every other artist I know of sugar coats it romantically or
turns it into something degrading (or into total melodramic theatre, a la
NIN.) Matt tells it
like it is, baby. All the sticky, icky, messy parts of love and sex we all have
to go through. Even when he's talking about it in a sweeter way (eg
Beyond Love)
it's still pretty stark and honest..... "We stand naked as the day we were
born, and tremble like animals, before a coming storm..." Beautiful
poetry, eh?

------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Stop beating up on Beat(en) Generation!
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 06:33:09 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511031333.GAA29071@getnet.com>

Some of us actually LIKE that song, you know. Just becuase it's catchy
doesn't mean it's not meaningful!

>Hirshdave wrote:
>
>>...personally i hate it when i hear another's influence in the music, such as
>>beaten generation, which always sounded to me like lame watered down smiths.
>
>---Matt played the acoustic guitar part on Beaten, which is most frequently
>associated Marr-esque writing. So perhaps, he is guilty of authoring the
>atrocious piece of pop garbage himself. (:) I've always wondered what
>"written by" meant anyway. I always imagined Matt sitting on a porch with
>acoustic guitar in hand, sucking on iced tea from a pickeling jar, next to
>an ashtray packed with sodden butts which inspire d.e.e.p. t.h.o.u.g.h.t.s.
>I think i've hit the nail on the head this time--right right (;)
>
>
>>...i happen to think that eric guy is pretty damn good on hanky panky. not so
>>caught up in 1980's new wave like marr...

I know, I know, I'm a hopeless retro nerd, but I LOVE 80's New Wave.
Soul Mining IS 80's new wave technopop, if you haven't noticed.
Certainly a million times better than all that grunge crap out now....

------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Marr v. Schemerhorn
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 06:52:59 -0701 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511031353.GAA00363@getnet.com>


> Anyway, sorry to ramble, but my point is that it seems like, when it
>comes to THE THE, it's going to me "Matt's way" or "no way." (You go
>along with what Matt says, or you hit the road). This is why I also
>think that, although he's talented, he's also arrogant, conceited, and
>quite dominating and inflexible when it comes to the musicians who work
>with him on THE THE's albums.
>
>Freeze
>bksst6+@pitt.edu

Ummm, aren't we missing the point here folks? Matt Johnson IS the The.
And it's not a John Lennon was the Beatles type thing here. Some bands
have dominant personalities that people think of as being the representative
of the band (ie Eddie Vedder in Pearl Jam or Bono in U2) yet it is obvious
that they are a band, with several equal partners. Even in bands like
The Cure, which many people just think of as Robert Smith and whoever
is in the room with him, have definite other personalities that exert influence.
Granted, Marr had a definite influence on the The. Someone of his caliber
would be expected to. But that doesn't change the fact that the The is just
another name for "Matt Johnson." It's much more interesting to be called
by a name - that's why Trent Reznor calls himself "Nine Inch Nails" even
though it's just him and his musicians. The name the The denotes the artist,
Matt Johnson, not a group. To call him arrogant is beside the point.
That would be like calling Van Gogh arrogant for firing the man who
streches his canvases. They are his employees, hired to help him
execute his work, not their idea of what his work should be.
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Marr v. Schemerhorn
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 07:04:05 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511031404.HAA00967@getnet.com>


>> no offense, but am i the only one with the
>> impression of matt as a very talented, able,
>> and conceited/arrogant musician?
>
>Funny you should mention that, because I remember having a discussion
>some other time with some The The fans scattered around the continent,
>whether or not he would be absolutely evil in person. I was one of the
>people who maintained the opinion that, since it's his anger more than
>anything I appreciate in his music, it'd likely shine through in his
>personal conversation, etc. If I ever saw him in concert and got a
>chance to speak to him in person, I figured he'd be a right bastard.

What someone expresses in their art is a measure of what they are
like on the inside - what they are thinking and feeling, not how they
behave in polite society. It works the other way too - personal
conversation is usually pretty routine and dull - not something you'd
write about in music. At least to casual friends and strangers, anger
and angst don't come out, anyway (we usually save it for the ones
we love!). Also, if one regularily vented one's anger and frustration
in one's art, one would think that it would help it from spilling over
into regular life.

That isn't to say, however, that he isn't a challenging and difficult
person to deal with. Given the intense nature of his music, it doesn't
seem too outlandish to conclude he might be an intense person
whilst making that music. Intense and challenging aren't the same
as "a right bastard", though.
------------------------------
From: Steven W Hill
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Discography
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 95 9:54:22 CST
Message-Id: <9511031554.AA11075@harper.cc.il.us>

First, an apology: after double-checking for typos, I posted the URL for
the discography, and of course it had a typo. Most people would have
caught it though.

The correct URL:
http://www.idis.com/shill/tt/thethe20.htm

I spent about another three hours on it last night. More scans. Sorry for
those of you who have trouble with tons of graphics! A trimmed version
will be worked on soon, but I want to finish the maxi-version first.

So check out the new changes.

I plan to add much more credit information as well as lyrics that have
been typed in the same way as presented (either handwritten or typeset)
on the sleeves. Anyone try this yet? Also, any other wishes will be
duly considered. Email me.
- --
[][] [][] Steve Hill, Network Communications Specialist, 708-925-6273
[] [] [] Harper College, 1200 W Algonquin Rd, Palatine IL 60067-7398
----shill@harper.cc.il.us----http://www.harper.cc.il.us----
[] [] [] "Lousy Smarch weather!"
[][] [][] personal:(http://www.idis.com/shill/index.htm)
------------------------------
From: SVentana@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Group Virgin Here
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 16:20:35 -0500
Message-ID: <951103162034_97262796@mail06.mail.aol.com>

Hello, all. This is my first post after just joining the list seconds ago, so
bear with me. I wanted a status report on "Gun Sluts" -- is a release date
set yet, and has anyone heard what the feel of the album will be like?
Lastly, have tentative tour dates been released yet?
------------------------------
From: mvanderl@ozemail.com.au (Michael Vanderlaan)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Trivial
Date: Fri, 03 Nov 95 23:08:45 GMT
Message-ID:


> On Fri, 3 Nov 1995, Darren "Dez" Lightfoot wrote:
>
> > Spot on Pandora. I hate the way that these so called the The fans refer
> > to Matt being a group. And whilst I am on the subject of things that bug
> > me on this list, for al of you that cant spell it is 'the The' and not
> > 'The The' or however you would like to put it.
> >
> > DEZ
> >
> >
> >
> do you mean for ALL of us that cant spell (dork)
> Ray

Spot on Ray. Anyhow, "Dez", why not lighten up a little; I appreciate this
forum for it's soul-mining souls who share a similar taste to myself, not for
trivial pedants with unconstructive comments. Stick to the positives.....

Mick
------------------------------
From: Scott
To: "'EVERYONE ON THE LIST!'"
Subject: ANY WORD?
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 16:02:39 -0600
Message-ID: <01BAAA06.4BC2E720@steamer>

I know there is another Marr lover who is dying to know when the new =
Electronic album will come out. In an interview in the summer Johnny =
said it was due in October. No word has come since then. Somebody help =
me?
------------------------------
From: marice@students.wisc.edu (elvis)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: This pretty much sums up my life!
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 12:00:14 +0700
Message-Id:

>Which leads me to a new discussion topic, if y'all are willing
>to get a bit more personal.

>If you could pick a the The song to sum up your life, which one
>would it be?

bluer than midnight:

Save me, Save me, Save me
Save me, Save me, Save me.

The candles are lit. The curtains are drawn.
There's still no sign of rain nor dawn.
Our lips touch. Our limbs entwine.
But the ghosts that haunt me won't leave my mind.

Save me, Save me, Save me
Save me, Save me, from myself.

One sin leads to another one.
Oh, the harder I try
I can never, never, never find peace in this life.
I ask myself where does lust come from
Is it something to yield to or be overcome.
I ask myself
Why love can never touch my heart like fear does.
Why can't love ever touch my heart like fear does?


- --------------------------------------

ahhhhhh, the love of torturing yourself! the cheap life of the hardcore
romantic...*sigh*
- -elvis

------------------------------
From: "ceylon@shadow.net"
To: "'infected@cs.uchicago.edu'"
Subject: RE: This pretty much sums up my life!
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 00:29:41 -0500
Message-ID: <01BAABE0.559EBB80@ppp-mia-45.shadow.net>

All I have to say is...1)Who replaced the prozac with tic-tacs 2) Goodness.

- ----------
From: pandora@getnet.com[SMTP:pandora@getnet.com]
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 1995 6:16 AM
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: This pretty much sums up my life!

>>Which leads me to a new discussion topic, if y'all are willing
>>to get a bit more personal.
>
>>If you could pick a the The song to sum up your life, which one
>>would it be?
>
>bluer than midnight:
>
>Save me, Save me, Save me
>Save me, Save me, Save me.
>
>The candles are lit. The curtains are drawn.
>There's still no sign of rain nor dawn.
>Our lips touch. Our limbs entwine.
>But the ghosts that haunt me won't leave my mind.
>
>Save me, Save me, Save me
>Save me, Save me, from myself.
>
>One sin leads to another one.
>Oh, the harder I try
>I can never, never, never find peace in this life.
>I ask myself where does lust come from
>Is it something to yield to or be overcome.
>I ask myself
>Why love can never touch my heart like fear does.
>Why can't love ever touch my heart like fear does?
>
>
>--------------------------------------
>
>ahhhhhh, the love of torturing yourself! the cheap life of the hardcore
>romantic...*sigh*
>-elvis
>
>
>

More like sex slave!!! You slut!!!!!

------------------------------
From: James Bykowy
To: "ceylon@shadow.net"
cc: "'infected@cs.uchicago.edu'"
Subject: RE: This pretty much sums up my life!
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 00:58:52 -0600 (CST)
Message-ID:



> >>Which leads me to a new discussion topic, if y'all are willing
> >>to get a bit more personal.
> >
> >>If you could pick a the The song to sum up your life, which one
> >>would it be?

August & September. Maybe not my entire life, but I've sure felt it.
Had a REALLY intense 14 month relationship that ended really badly, and
hung on, and then just kept on ending... it was gross. My friends still
bug me about what a hag she was and how different I'd become.

Ooh, she was awful. At the time of the breakup, I gained a large
appreciation for some of the less respectful tunes by Pursuit of
Happiness on the One Sided Story album - hey... another BRILLIANT
Canadian band. Worth checking out, even if you're not caught in the
death throes of a self-destructive relationship.

James (ab956@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca)

"Thirty days has September, October, June, and February...
All the rest have thirty-one, except my brother,
Who got six months."
- Peter Sellers as "Hrundi V. Bakshi", The Party


------------------------------
From: Scot R Stanfield
To: "infected@cs.uchicago.edu"
Subject: RE: This pretty much sums up my life!
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 07:39:39 -0700
Message-Id: <01BAAC1B.3F8FE7C0@cgyr1.ccinet.ab.ca>



- ----------
From: pandora@getnet.com[SMTP:pandora@getnet.com]
Sent: Saturday, November 04, 1995 11:22 PM

Which leads me to a new discussion topic, if y'all are willing
to get a bit more personal.=20

If you could pick a the The song to sum up your life, which one
would it be?

No Question, no doubt - "Another Boy Drowning". I'm a bitter, cynical =
Graphic Designer who converted to Judaism years ago. All the words fit, =
the music seeps into my brain and I can feel the anger on the other end =
of the microphone.

Scot

"I've bumped into him a couple of times in the street. I think he =
changes hi name from time to time. Why do you ask?" DA

------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: This pretty much sums up my life!
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 06:22:58 -0701 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511051323.GAA14800@getnet.com>


>The Sinking Feeling
>All my books lay on the table, waiting to unfold. I sit and stare at my
>reflection, while the darkness chills my bones. My head fills like a junk
>shop, in desperate need of repair.
>The path of least resistance leads to the garbage heap of despair. (I think
>I'd better get back in bed!!)
>"I'm just a symptom of the moral decay thats gnawing at the heart of the
>country."
>You can't destroy your problems by destroying yourself. Death is not the
>answer for your soul may burn in hell. My memory, my fond deceiver, is
>turning all my past into pain.
>While I'm being raped by progress, tomorrow's world is here to stay.
>(I wouldn't have it any other way.)

Reading this song makes me realize why I love it so much - not
just the great musc, but those lyrics really (unfortunately) sums
up my pathetic life. (only so far, I hope.)

Which leads me to a new discussion topic, if y'all are willing
to get a bit more personal.

If you could pick a the The song to sum up your life, which one
would it be?

BTW, I just love those half-sarcastic but really deadly serious
asides he puts in the song (denoted by HD in parenthesis.)
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: This pretty much sums up my life!
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 11:16:03 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511051816.LAA01154@getnet.com>

>>Which leads me to a new discussion topic, if y'all are willing
>>to get a bit more personal.
>
>>If you could pick a the The song to sum up your life, which one
>>would it be?
>
>bluer than midnight:
>
>Save me, Save me, Save me
>Save me, Save me, Save me.
>
>The candles are lit. The curtains are drawn.
>There's still no sign of rain nor dawn.
>Our lips touch. Our limbs entwine.
>But the ghosts that haunt me won't leave my mind.
>
>Save me, Save me, Save me
>Save me, Save me, from myself.
>
>One sin leads to another one.
>Oh, the harder I try
>I can never, never, never find peace in this life.
>I ask myself where does lust come from
>Is it something to yield to or be overcome.
>I ask myself
>Why love can never touch my heart like fear does.
>Why can't love ever touch my heart like fear does?
>
>
>--------------------------------------
>
>ahhhhhh, the love of torturing yourself! the cheap life of the hardcore
>romantic...*sigh*
>-elvis
>
>
>

More like sex slave!!! You slut!!!!!
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: RE: This pretty much sums up my life!
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 02:06:56 -0701 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511070907.CAA14841@getnet.com>

>All I have to say is...1)Who replaced the prozac with tic-tacs 2) Goodness.


Hey... I was just joshin'. No offense intended!


(that's a great line, "prozac and tic-tacs", btw. I will have to remember it.)
------------------------------
From: marice@students.wisc.edu (elvis)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: RE: This pretty much sums up my life!
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 01:31:35 -0600
Message-Id:

>> >>Which leads me to a new discussion topic, if y'all are willing
>> >>to get a bit more personal.
>> >
>> >>If you could pick a the The song to sum up your life, which one
>> >>would it be?
>
>August & September. Maybe not my entire life, but I've sure felt it.
>Had a REALLY intense 14 month relationship that ended really badly, and
>hung on, and then just kept on ending... it was gross. My friends still
>bug me about what a hag she was and how different I'd become.
>
>Ooh, she was awful. At the time of the breakup, I gained a large
>appreciation for some of the less respectful tunes by Pursuit of
>Happiness on the One Sided Story album - hey... another BRILLIANT
>Canadian band. Worth checking out, even if you're not caught in the
>death throes of a self-destructive relationship.
>
>James (ab956@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca)
>
>"Thirty days has September, October, June, and February...
> All the rest have thirty-one, except my brother,
> Who got six months."
> - Peter Sellers as "Hrundi V. Bakshi", The Party
>
>
wow! i thought i was the only one! i just ended a six year stint with some
dork....i listened to Aug. and Sept. almost non-stop....weird..
- -elvis

------------------------------
From: marice@students.wisc.edu (elvis)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: This pretty much sums up my life!
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 17:15:18 -0600
Message-Id:

bluer than midnight lyrics...
said I, elvis....master of the panflute...
>>ahhhhhh, the love of torturing yourself! the cheap life of the hardcore
>>romantic...*sigh*
>>-elvis
>>
>>
Said Pandora:
>
>More like sex slave!!! You slut!!!!!

says I....

hunh? gawk! ...me?!?....hunh?

- --->sorry about the one-liner, folks............
- -the one and only king of rock n roll;
elvis

------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: sexuality
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 05:58:47 -0701 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511051259.FAA13746@getnet.com>

>The first time I heard MJ's voice, I knew I was hooked. When I hear him
>whispering or pleading to the generic "you" in his songs, I feel as if
>he's speaking to me...Whenever I see him in concert I can't believe I'm
>actually looking at the man who writes such powerful, personal things and
>shares them with the world. Can anyone relate or am I merely obsessed?
> wendy
>

I can relate. Matt has such a great voice - "whispering and pleading"
is a good description. It's so sensual and expressive.
I've often marveled at the fact that the same person
wrote that great music and lyrics and was gifted with the perfect voice to
express it with. Some of his lyrics are so great simply because of the way
he sings them.
------------------------------
From: Scott
To: "'EVERYONE ON THE LIST!'"
Subject: RE: sexuality
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 15:39:41 -0600
Message-ID: <01BAAB96.149BAA20@steamer>

Just a note on the whisper part of his voice. I am a studio engineer and =
have studied the The intensely. George Martin (beatles) Gave "Good =
Morning Beautiful" an award for Best sounding track of '89. The reason =
is that matt spends much time sparing little expense in making =
everytrhing absolutely perfect. His voice is like that because after he =
sings the main line, he actually Does Whisper the same thing again, and =
then they mix the two voice tracks together. So, while it is nothing =
short of amazing, it is also really 2 matts singing much of the time (at =
least on mind bomb).
Listen Closely. And he sings some VERY clever harmony parts, too. In =
Music school,One thing
I was told Not to do
is use octave harmonies. Matt does this alot, to his beautiful benefit. =
"Jealous of youth" has
a High octave harmony on "I wanna live" that is mixed delicately so as =
to give the illusion that
his natural voice contains this overtone. The 12 inch version has this =
Falsetto part appearing without the main vocal. check it out. While your =
at it, listen to Violence of Truth
and see if you can count how many different guitar lines Johnny plays. =
I have counted at least
7. The frenzied wah part at the end is at least 2 guitars blended =
together. He calls it the "super bad riff"... I agree. If anyone wants =
to know more of their tricks, I have read
a Guitar Player Magazine with much info about their secrets and have =
found some through
careful active listening. Ask Me.----------
From: pandora@getnet.com[SMTP:pandora@getnet.com]
Sent: Saturday, November 04, 1995 11:58 PM
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: sexuality

>The first time I heard MJ's voice, I knew I was hooked. When I hear =
him=20
>whispering or pleading to the generic "you" in his songs, I feel as if=20
>he's speaking to me...Whenever I see him in concert I can't believe I'm =

>actually looking at the man who writes such powerful, personal things =
and=20
>shares them with the world. Can anyone relate or am I merely obsessed? =

> wendy
>

I can relate. Matt has such a great voice - "whispering and pleading"=20
is a good description. It's so sensual and expressive.
I've often marveled at the fact that the same person
wrote that great music and lyrics and was gifted with the perfect voice =
to
express it with. Some of his lyrics are so great simply because of the =
way
he sings them. =20

alize why I love it so much - not
just the great musc, but those lyrics really (unfortunately) sums
up my pathetic life. (only so far, I hope.)=20

Which leads me to a new discussion topic, if y'all are willing
to get a bit more personal.=20

If you could pick a the The song to sum up your life, which one
would it be? =20

BTW, I just love those half-sarcastic but really deadly serious
asides he puts in the song (denoted by HD in parenthesis.)



------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: sexuality
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 06:06:45 -0701 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511051307.GAA14085@getnet.com>

>You are obsessed, but not just "merely". Many of us feel the same way or
>we would not be on this list, or listening to Matt.
>
>Do you really feel that the "you" is generic?
>
>Dave
>
>djelline@haverford.edu

If not, I'd like to know who. Fiona? Not anymore.
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: sexuality
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 08:05:33 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511051505.IAA19379@getnet.com>

>>
>>If not, I'd like to know who. Fiona? Not anymore.
>
>But maybe it was then...
>Do we know anything about that part of his life? Their relationship, who
>he dated, etc... I always just kinda assumed he'd been with at least
>Sinead and Neneh, but that was just my impression from the music...
>
>Dave

Just because he sang with them about love and sex? That's a little
too easy of a correlation. While it's certainly probable, I just think
he picked them because he needed a duet partner. They were both
part of the UK scene then and available for that kind of work, maybe
even friends or someone whose work he admired, but to say that
he slept with them just because they sang together is quite a jump.
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: sexuality
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 02:10:45 -0701 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511070911.CAA15155@getnet.com>


>On _Alive_, Matt talks about the duet with Sinead. He said that he
>sent her the song, she liked it, she came in and recorded it, then she
>left. End of story. He also mentioned that the song was for his
>girlfriend, and it related to what was going on with them at the time.
>He said that Sinead was apparantly going through some hard times in her
>life, and because of that, she sang the song with a sort of anger that
>really fits. I agree.

Which girlfriend? Wasn't that too long ago to have been Fiona? I was
under the impression, correct me if I'm wrong, that they broke up
only fairly recently, like within the past two years or so.

Is "Alive" the interview disc/record? How can I get my hands on it?

Jenna
------------------------------
From: dougcha
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: sexuality
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 95 14:34:41 PST
Message-Id: <9511060745.AA03836@netmail2.microsoft.com>

>>he dated, etc... I always just kinda assumed he'd been with at least
>>Sinead and Neneh, but that was just my impression from the music...
>>
>>Dave
>
>Just because he sang with them about love and sex? That's a little
>too easy of a correlation. While it's certainly probable, I just think
>he picked them because he needed a duet partner. They were both
>part of the UK scene then and available for that kind of work, maybe
>even friends or someone whose work he admired, but to say that
>he slept with them just because they sang together is quite a jump.
>

On _Alive_, Matt talks about the duet with Sinead. He said that he
sent her the song, she liked it, she came in and recorded it, then she
left. End of story. He also mentioned that the song was for his
girlfriend, and it related to what was going on with them at the time.
He said that Sinead was apparantly going through some hard times in her
life, and because of that, she sang the song with a sort of anger that
really fits. I agree.


Doug

------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: RE: Soul Mining Lyrics
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 06:05:32 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511051305.GAA14006@getnet.com>

>I seem to remember that Behfar's page had some lyrics on it, but it's
>been quite a while since I've checked it out and I've lost the address.
> You might want to check there.
>
>
>Doug

Behfar has a page? Is it just his page or is it a the The page? The
only the The pages I know of are the Sony page and Ben Cabell's page.
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: soul mining lyrics
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 06:16:19 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511051316.GAA14496@getnet.com>

>I've been hounded by fairweather 'friends' sewing the sees for my discontent.<

Should'nt that be sowing the seeds?

Exactly how do you sew a see, anyway? ;-)

Sorry, I couldn't resist. Dave did a great job and with all that
typing one would expect a few typos.

Thanks Dave!
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Stage presence
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 06:27:41 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511051327.GAA15034@getnet.com>

>Yes, I once had the displeasure of "conversing" with him after a
>devastating show. Displeasure, because I could only formulate the words
>"great show", "I love your music...daaa" and a series of primordial grunts.
>Go figure. I could have asked about lust on a lighter note!


What is the deal here? Is it just my imagination, or have half of you
guys met MJ? (you lucky things!)
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: the The fans common interests
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 06:34:27 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511051334.GAA15362@getnet.com>

>
>Following that one posting asking us all to reveal our true identities, I
>noticed that a large number of members of this group are computer types
>of one sort or another. Yep, I'm one. So, can anybody postulate a
>unifying theory? What gives? My fiancee loves the The like I do (good
>thing) but only after I had introduced her to the music, and she's the
>most anti-technological person on earth. No matter what anybody says.
>

I think the fact that many of us are in computer related fields has less
to do with the fact that we all like the The than the fact that this is
the Internet. Many of the people on the other lists I subscribe to
and on the newsgroups are also computer professionals. They
are the ones most likely to have a computer and be on the Internet.
(so far; that is changing rapidly. I recently heard a statistic - I
don't know if it's true or not - that the amount of 15 year olds on
the computer has surpassed the amount watching TV.)
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: updated info? (fwd)
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 06:52:15 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511051352.GAA16029@getnet.com>

> I made an inquiry to thethexxx@aol.com as to how far into the
>recording process the GunSluts project is and when we can expect to see
>it released, and they sent me a seemingly generic response:
>
>Freeze
>bksst6+@pitt.edu
>---------- Forwarded message ----------
>Date: Thu, 19 Oct 1995 20:45:17 -0400
>From:THETHEXXX@aol.com
>To: bksst6+@pitt.edu
>Subject: Re: updated info?
>
>These are the THE THE WorldWideWeb sites. Much visuals and audio. Hope you
>have Mosaic or Netscape.
>
>http://www.wpi.edu/~thethe/thethe/thethe.html (independent site)
>
>http://www.sony.com/Music/ArtistInfo/TheThe.html (Sony site)
>
>Send an e-mail to
>infected@CS.UChicago.EDU
>with the word "subscribe" in it to get on a correspondance e-mail list
>
>Send your mailing address to receive a printed newsletter
>
>"Gun Sluts" in 96
>
>Not tour till "Gun Sluts" in 96
>

All right, I'm finally going to come out of the closet on this one.

Does anybody else out there supect that Steve Rennie (Matt's
manager and the owner of the computer on which the THETHEXXX
AOL address comes from) is an egotistical jerk?

I used to be on AOL and frequented the the The folder there.
In the dealings we had with Steve Rennie (who went by Rendad)
he was very patronizing and sometimes rude. I also got IM'd (sent
an live instant message for you non-aol types) by someone using
his account (Steve later said in the folder that he lets his employees
use his account, and it may have been D.C. Collard jacking around)
who totally messed around with me and said all sorts
of rude sexual things (and I am far from prudish or easily offended)
and basically made me feel like a fool. It made me mad
for days and still leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

All the missives from THETHEXXX I've seen have been very aloof and
sometimes even condescending. I understand they don't have time
to reply to email personally, and have to send out form letters, but they
could at least be friendly!
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: weird the the song....
Date: Sun, 5 Nov 1995 07:27:07 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511051427.HAA17662@getnet.com>

>Hey everyone...
>
>I bought this the the compliation tape a while back that has rare tracks on it
>and there is this one song on the tape titled "The The". I t goes something
>like this....... " all this and more.....all this and the moores murders"
>and something like someone "got their head screwed on tight" I was wondering
>if this was a gadgets tune or a mj solo release song.....anyone know?????

ice cream in the sun....ice cream in the sunday papers....


Yeah, this is a weird song. That isn't Matt's voice saying that, is it?
It doesn't sound like it.
------------------------------
From: "ceylon@shadow.net"
To: "'Infected@cs.uchicago.edu'"
Subject: Whispering and such
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 00:38:49 -0500
Message-ID: <01BAABE0.5834F6C0@ppp-mia-45.shadow.net>

This is kinda off topic,but, did everyone notice the groaning "Dogs of =
Lust" throughout 'Lung Shadows?' --It's rather faint and muffled in the =
mix,however it's quite audible. The reason I mention this is: I was =
misled by Dusk until I "heard" it. I thought it was a album about =
sadness and introspect, until I started to piece things together. Any =
other sexual allusion I'm missing?
------------------------------
From: Smitten123@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: RE:Whispering and such
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 13:02:31 -0500
Message-ID: <951106130227_99260065@emout04.mail.aol.com>



About the post concerning the groaning, dogs of lust throughout "lung
shoadows":

Do you mean the clip from the porno that is in there? The one that you can
only
hear when you turn the volume way up? The one that goes something like
"ooo....
ohhh..........shit........oh, fuck me hard?

As far as other sexual oriented comments/lyrics are concerned....when isn't
Matt
doing that? He's a pervert....of sorts....that's why we love him so much.
Really, he isn't a pervert, he just seems to know what he likes (sexually)
and writes about it. No?

I can bring up a conversation that me and a friend had over the song "Sodium
light baby" that might interest some of you (well, not Dave Hirsch cause he
of course already knows all that is the The ;) ). It basically surrounded
the idea that "sodium light baby"
was a term Matt has made up for "a prostitute." The lyrics support this
hypothesis. Ya see, most street lights now, use a "light bulb" (what's the
correct term?) that uses a mixture of sodium-something-er-other for
illumination. Since most street lights tend to be on street corners....where
the "stereo-typical" hooker would be....do you get the point? Some people
have been like..."wow" after hearing this, while others are like "uh, i don't
know." What do you all think? "shine on me. Sodium light baby." I bet.

Finally, I was talking to Dave Hirsch about how many people on here like the
smiths.
Since Dave and I are HUGE fans of the smiths (got ya dave), a question for
you:
Did you get into the The because of Mr. Marr, or do you just happen to like
the smiths as well as the The?

JaY


------------------------------
From: "Woltjer, Wendy - Canton"
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: repression and expression
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 14:37:29 -0500 (EST)
Message-ID:

About the Smiths/the The connection, I first started listening to the
The because of Marr's involvement. I find the two quite opposites, since
Morrissey's lyrics seem to dance around sexuality while Matt's blatantly
celebrate it. I think that's why I like both--they are seductive in
different ways....
wendy
------------------------------
From: Genepool@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: repression and expression
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 13:20:09 -0500
Message-ID: <951107131956_100274318@mail02.mail.aol.com>

<
I listened to both before from the beginning (well at least when Soul Mining
first came out.

I was happy to see Marr involved with the The but like some of the earlier
guitar work just as much.

Steve
------------------------------
From: marice@students.wisc.edu (elvis)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: repression and expression
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 14:38:20 -0600
Message-Id:

>About the Smiths/the The connection, I first started listening to the
>The because of Marr's involvement. I find the two quite opposites, since
>Morrissey's lyrics seem to dance around sexuality while Matt's blatantly
>celebrate it. I think that's why I like both--they are seductive in
>different ways....
> wendy

Morrissey isn't seductive...he's celebate (or however the fuck you spell
that, i don't care!).....MJ is ultimately seductive...he has too much sex
drive and knows it and understands it and indulges in it....that's why he's
so fucking cool....most people don't even try to UNDERSTAND it...they just
go around copulating and indulging right off the bat without even thinking
of the moral implications therein...
- -end of tyrade-
- ------elvis

------------------------------
From: Brandon K Snavely
To: elvis
cc: Infected
Subject: Re: repression and expression
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 19:15:59 -0500 (EST)
Message-ID:

> Morrissey isn't seductive...he's celebate (or however the fuck you spell
> that, i don't care!).....MJ is ultimately seductive...he has too much sex
> drive and knows it and understands it and indulges in it....that's why he's
> so fucking cool....most people don't even try to UNDERSTAND it...they just
> go around copulating and indulging right off the bat without even thinking
> of the moral implications therein...
> -end of tyrade-

Yes, Morrissey is celebate, but that doesn't have anything to do with
how seductive his lyrics are! Morrissey is a very sexual lyricist--there
are sexual innuendos and implications in almost all of his songs. MJ,
too, though I think that MJ goes about it in a more direct, less subtle
way. Both are brilliant lyricists and songwriters.

Freeze
bksst6+@pitt.edu
------------------------------
From: marice@students.wisc.edu (elvis)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: RE:Whispering and such
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 14:31:20 -0600
Message-Id:


>Finally, I was talking to Dave Hirsch about how many people on here like the
>smiths.
>Since Dave and I are HUGE fans of the smiths (got ya dave), a question for
>you:
>Did you get into the The because of Mr. Marr, or do you just happen to like
>the smiths as well as the The?
>
>JaY

- -------
i got into the The because of Sinead o' conner.
- -elvis

------------------------------
From: James Bykowy
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Fave lyrics
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 01:08:04 -0600 (CST)
Message-ID:


Sorry, I'm not up to date on my mail (I poured through over 60 messages
today), so I don't know how current this will be but...

I've always appreciated the lyrics from the song "The Waiting Hour":

A red sky night might be a sailor's delight
But you're cutting chunks from your heart,
And rubbing the meat into your eyes.

When I finally deciphered what he was actually saying, I shivered.

I think my second favourite (which also happens to be playing for me at
this very moment) was from August & September:

What kind of man was I, who would delay your destiny
to satisfy his pride / appease his achen, swollen pride / screamin little
mind.

James

"Thirty days has September, October, June, and February...
All the rest have thirty-one, except my brother,
Who got six months."
- Peter Sellers as "Hrundi V. Bakshi", The Party

------------------------------
From: psj@re.dk
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Fave lyrics
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 10:02:30 +0200
Message-Id: <199511060859.AA26257@ic1.ic.dk>


James wrote:

****
I think my second favourite (which also happens to be playing for me at
this very moment) was from August & September:

What kind of man was I, who would delay your destiny
to satisfy his pride / appease his achen, swollen pride / screamin little
mind.
****
That is truly a great song. "Was our love too strong to die ../ ..were we=20
just too weak to kill it.. /

YES!! Plagued by the demons of insecurity and indecision the subject=20
passively opted to stay in a relationship which he knew was destined to=20
fail. Ring any bells?

Paul
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Fave lyrics
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 01:41:29 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511070841.BAA12374@getnet.com>


>Sorry, I'm not up to date on my mail (I poured through over 60 messages
>today), so I don't know how current this will be but...

It may not be current but it's always interesting to hear....

>I've always appreciated the lyrics from the song "The Waiting Hour":

Actually it's "The Twilight Hour."

>A red sky night might be a sailor's delight
>But you're cutting chunks from your heart,
>And rubbing the meat into your eyes.
>
>When I finally deciphered what he was actually saying, I shivered.

What exactly do you think that means? (or at least, what does
it mean to you?) Anyone else have input? (anyone, anyone?)
I've always wondered what exactly MJ meant by those lines.
I always thought that song got a little too personal, because it reminded
me how one boyfriend used to act. "It's way past the hour she usually calls.
Where could she have got to? Why is she torturing me?" And the line
"You're afraid of losing her...and facing yourself" also describes how
I've felt on occaision before.

>I think my second favourite (which also happens to be playing for me at
>this very moment) was from August & September:
>
>What kind of man was I, who would delay your destiny
>to satisfy his pride / appease his achen, swollen pride / screamin little
>mind.

I also love the bit about "Was our love too strong to die....or were just
too weak to kill it?" Typical of Matt, twisting a common concept, and
self-analyzing to death....love it. He gave a stunning live performance
of this song the last time I saw him in concert, btw.
------------------------------
From: James Bykowy
To: pandora@getnet.com
cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Fave lyrics
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 20:35:12 -0600 (CST)
Message-ID:


> >I've always appreciated the lyrics from the song "The Waiting Hour":
>
> Actually it's "The Twilight Hour."

OOPS - pardonnez-moi...

> >A red sky night might be a sailor's delight
> >But you're cutting chunks from your heart,
> >And rubbing the meat into your eyes.
> >
> >When I finally deciphered what he was actually saying, I shivered.
>
> What exactly do you think that means? (or at least, what does
> it mean to you?) Anyone else have input? (anyone, anyone?)
> I've always wondered what exactly MJ meant by those lines.
> I always thought that song got a little too personal, because it reminded
> me how one boyfriend used to act. "It's way past the hour she usually calls.
> Where could she have got to? Why is she torturing me?" And the line
> "You're afraid of losing her...and facing yourself" also describes how
> I've felt on occaision before.

I think that's simply how it feels! Heart wrenching... It's like how
you're waiting, you're angry, and you're almost punishing yourself by
waiting just so you can stay angry. And by the time the anger turns to
confusion, fear, panic, whatever, it comes down so strong that it's like
the emotional equivalent to cutting chunks out of your heart.

Then again, others may have more in depth ideas on the "rubbing the meat
into your eyes" part.

James

"Thirty days has September, October, June, and February...
All the rest have thirty-one, except my brother,
Who got six months."
- Peter Sellers as "Hrundi V. Bakshi", The Party
------------------------------
From: Behfar Bastani-Booshehri
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: cutting chunks from your heart
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 13:40:28 -0600 (CST)
Message-Id: <199511081940.NAA02177@lily.cs.uchicago.edu>

James Bykowy writes:
> > >A red sky night might be a sailor's delight
> > >But you're cutting chunks from your heart,
> > >And rubbing the meat into your eyes.
> > >
> > >When I finally deciphered what he was actually saying, I shivered.
> >
> > What exactly do you think that means? (or at least, what does
> > it mean to you?) Anyone else have input? (anyone, anyone?)

it reminds me of the many times i've
tried to cover my eyes (figuratively speaking)
and not look at something that was just too
painful to face.

but in the end i have the feeling that
all i was doing was to knowingly hurt myself,
like cutting chunks from my heart, and deliberately avoid
facing the facts, by "rubbing the meat into my
eyes" and blind myself. ever wondered if you were
really your own best friend? ;)

sometimes life makes more sense with a proper soundtrack..


behfar
------------------------------
From: Joonas Virtasalo
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: BBS
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 1995 09:32:22 +0200
Message-Id: <199512070733.JAA27510@jazz>

At 13:17 4.12.1995 +0000, you wrote:

>bit of a taboo subject for some reason. Everyone discusses other albums
>at length, its different, but so is every album that Matt has written.
>What does anyone else think? To me when I listen it justs mellows you out

I somehow consider BBS the second best TheThe song, SM being the Best.
At least at the moment. TheThe albums are so great and various, that it's
quite hard to put them into any order.

- -----------------------------------------------------------------------
Joonas Virtasalo, Satakunta Polytechnic, ADP-Department ! !
joonas@jazz.cc.spt.fi, http://www.spt.fi/~joonas ! !
Karhukoppa BBS: +358-39-5383253, 24h, v.34 ! !
- -----------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
From: Scot R Stanfield
To: "'infected@cs.uchicago.edu'" ,
"'pandora@getnet.com'"
Subject: RE: discussion time.../Marr v. Schemerhorn
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 07:44:22 -0700
Message-Id: <01BAAC1B.DF4140C0@cgyr1.ccinet.ab.ca>



- ----------
From: pandora@getnet.com[SMTP:pandora@getnet.com]
Sent: Thursday, November 02, 1995 9:44 PM

(and of course, the obvious ones like TheCureDepcheModeTheSmiths
REMU2NirvanaPearlJam)=20

but basically the The is my favorite, the one I'm obsessed with....
I haven't felt that way about a band since I was 16, with the Cure.=20

Jenna

Ya' know, the funny thing is I liked the Smiths, my wife still loves =
them, but I realized the other day when she was forcing me to listen to =
Meat is Murder AGAIN, that I would absolutely love the band if I could =
just strip the damn whiny vocals out....

Matt Johnson is the The.
Johnny Marr was the Smiths.
Dave "Edge" Evans is U2 (sorry, Jenna - one of my peeves).
Paul Weller was the Jam, was the Style Council, is unemployed -
the list can go on and on, but the truth of the matter is that people =
inteact with the people around them and that affects them.=20
Will the The be the same now that Marr is gone? No. Just as Bowie isn't =
quite BOWIE without Eno. That's not a bad thing, it's change. Deal with =
it or don't - if someone's puuting a gun to your head and making you =
listen to this stuff you really have to re-evaluate your life choices.

I'm getting long winded and bitchy (sorry Mick), it time to sign off -

Scot=20

------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: RE: discussion time.../Marr v. Schemerhorn
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 03:23:11 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511071023.DAA22038@getnet.com>


>Ya' know, the funny thing is I liked the Smiths, my wife still loves them,
but I realized the other day when she was forcing me to listen to Meat is
Murder AGAIN, that I would absolutely love the band if I could just strip
the damn whiny vocals out....

Actually Meat is Murder is one of my favorite albums. I don't really have a
problem
with Morrissey's vocals. I have a couple of his albums and I liked them
fine too.
I've noticed for years that most people either HATE or LOVE the Smiths.
I'm sort of on the fence. I like them enough, but I'm not obsessed the way
some people are (or the way I am about other bands).

>Matt Johnson is the The.
Yes...

>Johnny Marr was the Smiths.
No. He definitely was a major part, but not the only part. How can
you discount Morrissey's part - fer chrissakes, he sang every song
and probably wrote or co-wrote most of them.

>Dave "Edge" Evans is U2 (sorry, Jenna - one of my peeves).
Again, unless he sang and wrote or co-wrote every song,
he is not U2. The three other members all had definite influences,
and while U2 wouldn't be U2 without the Edge, it wouldn't be U2
without Bono either (much as I loathe his sorry egotistical ass).
The song "Numb" proves as much. (I like it, but could you imagine
The Edge singing U2's entire catalogue? Brrrrr.)

>Paul Weller was the Jam, was the Style Council, is unemployed -
Didn't he have some solo hits?

>the list can go on and on, but the truth of the matter is that people
inteact with the people around them and that affects them.
>Will the The be the same now that Marr is gone? No. Just as Bowie isn't
quite BOWIE without Eno. That's not a bad thing, it's change.

Actually, the new album (Outside) is done with Eno, his first such since the
"Scary Monsters" era. And there are those who would argue with you
that Bowie without Eno IS a bad thing. (I'm not knowledgeable about him
enough to make that arguement, however.)


------------------------------
From: Hirschdave@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: discussion time.../Marr v. Schemerhorn
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 16:56:27 -0500
Message-ID: <951108165613_16635389@emout04.mail.aol.com>

how the hell could anyone listen to girlfriend in a coma or unhappy birthday
and take the guy seriously? and really, matt johnson doesn't have too many
songs about his clothing not being up to social standards.

------------------------------
From: Behfar Bastani-Booshehri
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: discussion time.../Marr v. Schemerhorn
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 16:28:08 -0600 (CST)
Message-Id: <199511082228.QAA02195@lily.cs.uchicago.edu>

Hirschdave@aol.com writes:
> how the hell could anyone listen to girlfriend in a coma or unhappy birthday
> and take the guy seriously? and really, matt johnson doesn't have too many
> songs about his clothing not being up to social standards.

if you like lyrics written by MJ,
that's because they speak to you.
perhaps you see a part of yourself
being portrayed by them.
i love what matt writes and the way he writes it.

if on the other hand nothing morrissey
writes touches you, then that does *not*
mean the man is not serious about what
he's singing.
the smiths don't have a loyal following
years after their break up just for lyrics
about clothings. tons of people identify
with the fears and emotions morrissey
writes about. and that's not just teens (as
if teen angst were unimportant and trivial!)
i personally don't know of any other singer
who has such a direct and sensitive connection
to the feelings of the depressed and the rejected
as morrissey does.

i think it takes a lot of guts and honesty to say
things the way he does. even if people feel it's
just whining around, it still doesn't mean he's
not serious about what he writes.

thanks for reading up to here.
behfar
------------------------------
From: James Drage
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: RE: discussion time.../Marr v. Schemerhorn
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 95 10:50:44 TZ
Message-Id: <9511081919.AA28736@netmail2.microsoft.com>

_/ >Ya' know, the funny thing is I liked the Smiths, my wife still loves them,
_/ but I realized the other day when she was forcing me to listen to Meat is
_/ Murder AGAIN, that I would absolutely love the band if I could just strip
_/ the damn whiny vocals out....

Amen!! That's one of the things I was most impressed about the band
Gene. Everyone says they are just a Smiths clone but not so... bit of
a harder edge and the lead singer doesn't keep complaining about how
nobody loves him and he's such a loser etc. etc.

So anybody know where I can get some the The fridge magnets and a huge
honkin' MJ sticker for my snowboard?

James

------------------------------
From: Madhatter
To: James Drage
Cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: RE: discussion time.../Marr v. Schemerhorn
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 16:22:04 -0500 (EST)
Message-Id:

On Wed, 8 Nov 1995, James Drage wrote:

> _/ >Ya' know, the funny thing is I liked the Smiths, my wife still loves them,
> _/ but I realized the other day when she was forcing me to listen to Meat is
> _/ Murder AGAIN, that I would absolutely love the band if I could just strip
> _/ the damn whiny vocals out....
>
> Amen!! That's one of the things I was most impressed about the band
> Gene. Everyone says they are just a Smiths clone but not so... bit of
> a harder edge and the lead singer doesn't keep complaining about how
> nobody loves him and he's such a loser etc. etc.
>
> So anybody know where I can get some the The fridge magnets and a huge
> honkin' MJ sticker for my snowboard?
>
> James
>
>
>
What is it with all this Morrissey-bashing!?! The man is a genius. I
love MJ, but to criticize Morrissey for being too whiney? I mean, MJ
goes on and on about his own failures, and we relate to him on some
level, so how can you turn around and say Morrissey whines too much? I'm
sorry, but you guys should really give the Smiths another chance. Their
musicd and lyrics are far too important to dismiss as simple teen-angst b.s.
------------------------------
From: marice@students.wisc.edu (elvis)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: discussion time.../Marr v. Schemerhorn
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 17:51:37 +0700
Message-Id:

>how the hell could anyone listen to girlfriend in a coma or unhappy birthday
>and take the guy seriously? and really, matt johnson doesn't have too many
>songs about his clothing not being up to social standards.

AMEN!!!!
- -elvis

------------------------------
From: uthelene@ix.netcom.com (Sharkless girl )
To: infected@CS.uchicago.edu
Subject: Fwd:
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 11:08:30 -0800
Message-Id: <199511061908.LAA06289@ix13.ix.netcom.com>

>From Derek's message:


Date: Fri, 3 Nov 1995 18:04:59 +0000 (GMT)
From: "Darren \"Dez\" Lightfoot"
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Message-Id:
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Spot on Pandora. I hate the way that these so called the The fans
refer
to Matt being a group. And whilst I am on the subject of things that
bug
me on this list, for al of you that cant spell it is 'the The' and not
'The The' or however you would like to put it.

DEZ


OOH, sacriliege (no spelling so don't even start with me). matt has
always been referred to as a group for as long as i have know his fans
and his music. he did everything, recorded, produced, played, wrote
most everything ever done, up until Mind Bomb if i'm not mistaken. I
think someone with that much talent and that much invested into a
musical effort has the righte, NEY, the obligation to do so. ;p

flames ahoy, well actually not a flame, just a sublte disagreement.
let the dueling begin.

euthelene, who spent her weekend cleaning up my neighbors dirty
bathwater because it broke my bathroom pipes, YUCK
------------------------------
From: Scott
To: "'Peter Caira'" ,
"'EVERYONE ON THE LIST!'"

Subject: RE: Fwd:
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 21:55:30 -0600
Message-ID: <01BAB14A.7BFBB660@steamer>

Matt likes the The to be referred to as a band/group/whatever. It is =
good. Do it, feel good about it. It is a multimedia concept, the The. It =
is fine.

- ----------
From: Peter Caira[SMTP:caira@server.uwindsor.ca]
Sent: Tuesday, November 07, 1995 3:39 PM
To: James Bykowy
Cc: elvis; infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Fwd:

On Tue, 7 Nov 1995, James Bykowy wrote:

> At the risk of becoming involved in the fray...
> Matt Johnson is the principal member of the The. If he thought he was =
a=20
> group, he'd probably call himself "Matt Johnson" or something =
creative. =20
> Or maybe even "Matt Johnson and the The". However, I tend to use the =
two=20
> terms interchangeably.

I tend to use theTHE and Matt Johnson interchangeably as well, but I=20
remember reading in the Burning Blue Soul liners that Matt originally=20
released it under his name, then re-released it as theTHE...so really,=20
theTHE was just a Matt Johnson...it's just like nine inch nails...it's=20
just Trent Reznor (except when live).

Peter Caira
caira@server.uwindsor.ca
http://supernova.uwindsor.ca/staff/caira

Give me life, give me pain, give me myself again



------------------------------
From: uthelene@ix.netcom.com (Sharkless girl )
To: Jeff Croft
Cc: infected@CS.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Fwd:
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 17:54:49 -0800
Message-Id: <199511080154.RAA17213@ix5.ix.netcom.com>

You wrote:
>
>
>
>On Mon, 6 Nov 1995, elvis wrote:
>
>> thanyou, euthelene for sticking up with MJ.....and please don't be
so
>> stuffy (addressed to everyone) we're so hot tempered about spelling,
sexual
>> connotation and life in general...sheesh...take a valium all....who
gives a
>
>Not valium... I think everyone could use a big bowl o' pot. I agree. I

>like it better when everyone is a little more laid back...
>
> Jeff
>jdcroft@eng.utah.edu
>
>
okay, everybody get stoned! maybe someone should write a song. and
just let me say that the 4AD listy is getting all huffy (no, not
huffing) over an apostrophe. My feeling is that all these anal
retentives will soon off themselves because the world will always be
imperfect, it must be hell running around trying to make it perfect.

anyhow, we all need "friends", i personally have enough "enemies". so
let's all be friends and get virtually high...

euthelene, who is crawling across the ceiling, in theory that is
------------------------------
From: euroboy@postoffice.ptd.net (micah stupak)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: RE: Fwd:
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 16:40:40 -0500
Message-Id: <199511132140.QAA16962@ns1.ptd.net>

>I tend to use theTHE and Matt Johnson interchangeably as well, but I
>remember reading in the Burning Blue Soul liners that Matt originally
>released it under his name, then re-released it as theTHE...so really,
>theTHE was just a Matt Johnson...it's just like nine inch nails...it's
>just Trent Reznor (except when live).
yep. the The live is also a group, but just about solitary studio.
tenderspot of the daphne. :)
euroboy@postoffice.ptd.net
comedy is the last refuge of the nonconformist mind.
------------------------------
From: DLT1977@aol.com
To: steamer@clearcom.com, caira@server.uwindsor.ca, infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: RE: Fwd:
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 17:31:50 -0500
Message-ID: <951114173145_84522532@emout06.mail.aol.com>

I heard on an interview the reason Burning Blue Soul was re-issued under the
The was becaue Matt felt that BBS was the first proper The The album.


Donnie
------------------------------
From: marice@students.wisc.edu (elvis)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Fwd:
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 14:43:39 -0600
Message-Id:

>From Derek's message:
>
>Spot on Pandora. I hate the way that these so called the The fans
>refer
>to Matt being a group. And whilst I am on the subject of things that
>bug
>me on this list, for al of you that cant spell it is 'the The' and not
>'The The' or however you would like to put it.
>
>DEZ

i don't refer to MJ as a group.....just as a spotlight person....i listen
to the The for Matt's lyrics...granted it wouldn't be as cool without the
great background, but i even like shit music with good lyrics more than
shit lyrics with good music (a la Pearl Jam)....
>
>
>OOH, sacriliege (no spelling so don't even start with me). matt has
>always been referred to as a group for as long as i have know his fans
>and his music. he did everything, recorded, produced, played, wrote
>most everything ever done, up until Mind Bomb if i'm not mistaken. I
>think someone with that much talent and that much invested into a
>musical effort has the righte, NEY, the obligation to do so. ;p

YOU ROCK MY CRACK DREAMS!!!!

>flames ahoy, well actually not a flame, just a sublte disagreement.
>let the dueling begin.
>
>euthelene, who spent her weekend cleaning up my neighbors dirty
>bathwater because it broke my bathroom pipes, YUCK

thanyou, euthelene for sticking up with MJ.....and please don't be so
stuffy (addressed to everyone) we're so hot tempered about spelling, sexual
connotation and life in general...sheesh...take a valium all....who gives a
shit if its the The or the the or thethe or THE THE...it's the same band,
same intent...i'm not making their record labels, are you...who
cares...it's still the same music...let's talk about that instead...

i woke up to True Happiness This Way Lies this morning...mmm...i feel warm
and fuzzy today........
- -elvis, the pacemaker

------------------------------
From: James Bykowy
To: elvis
cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Fwd:
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 20:10:24 -0600 (CST)
Message-ID:


> >Spot on Pandora. I hate the way that these so called the The fans
> >refer
> >to Matt being a group. And whilst I am on the subject of things that
> >bug
> >me on this list, for al of you that cant spell it is 'the The' and not
> >'The The' or however you would like to put it.

At the risk of becoming involved in the fray...
Matt Johnson is the principal member of the The. If he thought he was a
group, he'd probably call himself "Matt Johnson" or something creative.
Or maybe even "Matt Johnson and the The". However, I tend to use the two
terms interchangeably.

James

"Thirty days has September, October, June, and February...
All the rest have thirty-one, except my brother,
Who got six months."
- Peter Sellers as "Hrundi V. Bakshi", The Party



------------------------------
From: Peter Caira
To: James Bykowy
cc: elvis , infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Fwd:
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 21:39:33 -0500 (EST)
Message-ID:

On Tue, 7 Nov 1995, James Bykowy wrote:

> At the risk of becoming involved in the fray...
> Matt Johnson is the principal member of the The. If he thought he was a
> group, he'd probably call himself "Matt Johnson" or something creative.
> Or maybe even "Matt Johnson and the The". However, I tend to use the two
> terms interchangeably.

I tend to use theTHE and Matt Johnson interchangeably as well, but I
remember reading in the Burning Blue Soul liners that Matt originally
released it under his name, then re-released it as theTHE...so really,
theTHE was just a Matt Johnson...it's just like nine inch nails...it's
just Trent Reznor (except when live).

Peter Caira
caira@server.uwindsor.ca
http://supernova.uwindsor.ca/staff/caira

Give me life, give me pain, give me myself again
------------------------------
From: Jeff Croft
To: elvis
cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Fwd:
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 01:06:07 -0700 (MST)
Message-ID:



On Mon, 6 Nov 1995, elvis wrote:

> thanyou, euthelene for sticking up with MJ.....and please don't be so
> stuffy (addressed to everyone) we're so hot tempered about spelling, sexual
> connotation and life in general...sheesh...take a valium all....who gives a

Not valium... I think everyone could use a big bowl o' pot. I agree. I
like it better when everyone is a little more laid back...

Jeff
jdcroft@eng.utah.edu
------------------------------
From: James Bykowy
To: Jeff Croft
cc: elvis , infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Fwd:
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 20:15:59 -0600 (CST)
Message-ID:


> > thanyou, euthelene for sticking up with MJ.....and please don't be so
> > stuffy (addressed to everyone) we're so hot tempered about spelling, sexual
> > connotation and life in general...sheesh...take a valium all....who gives a
>
> Not valium... I think everyone could use a big bowl o' pot. I agree. I
> like it better when everyone is a little more laid back...

Kudos to you! Brilliant idea. How about something we all agree on, like...
Is the Volume 6 interview with Johnson part of the discography web site?
My copy of it is currently on loan to a friend right now, but, since
we're all into trivia so much, why not post it?

James


"Thirty days has September, October, June, and February...
All the rest have thirty-one, except my brother,
Who got six months."
- Peter Sellers as "Hrundi V. Bakshi", The Party

------------------------------
From: Steven W Hill
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Fwd:Volume 6
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 95 0:29:36 CST
Message-Id: <9511080630.AA13268@harper.cc.il.us>

> Kudos to you! Brilliant idea. How about something we all agree on, like...
> Is the Volume 6 interview with Johnson part of the discography web site?

Not part of mine, because at this point it's only a discography.
I might type it in someday, but it's not a very high priority in my schedule.
- -shill

- --
[][] [][] Steve Hill, Network Communications Specialist, 708-925-6273
[] [] [] Harper College, 1200 W Algonquin Rd, Palatine IL 60067-7398
----shill@harper.cc.il.us----http://www.harper.cc.il.us----
[] [] [] "Lousy Smarch weather!"
[][] [][] personal:(http://www.idis.com/shill/index.htm)
------------------------------
From: uthelene@ix.netcom.com (Sharkless girl )
Cc: infected@CS.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Fwd:Volume 6
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 05:26:16 -0800
Message-Id: <199511081326.FAA24842@ix11.ix.netcom.com>

You wrote:
>
>> Kudos to you! Brilliant idea. How about something we all agree on,
like...
>> Is the Volume 6 interview with Johnson part of the discography web
site?
>
>Not part of mine, because at this point it's only a discography.
>I might type it in someday, but it's not a very high priority in my
schedule.
>-shill
>
>--
>[][] [][] Steve Hill, Network Communications Specialist, 708-925-6273
>[] [] [] Harper College, 1200 W Algonquin Rd, Palatine IL 60067-7398
> ----shill@harper.cc.il.us----http://www.harper.cc.il.us----
>[] [] [] "Lousy Smarch weather!"
>[][] [][] personal:(http://www.idis.com/shill/index.htm)
>
I have this typed in, I did a series on UK artists and featured a
different one every week for about 4 months. A lot of work, but I have
the interview in hugo text for eay on-air reading. easy enough to
change that though. If anyone wants a copy, knock on the perverbial
primate mail box. or if wnough people want it i;ll post with a
warning.

euthelene who;s taken to using semi-colons instead of apostrophes
because it really irritates some people...actaully it is just because i
broke my pinky and can't always rech the apostrophe key...and that;s
the truth
------------------------------
From: "Pj aka Jack O'Showers"
To: Infected
Subject: Smiths/the The
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 15:33:13 -0500 (EST)
Message-Id:


As far as that subject goes, I got into the The before the smiths. I
liked Soul Mining, and when Mind Bomb came out, I loved it. Then, later
that year, I got into the Smiths. It took me a few months after that to
realize that Johnny Marr was in the same band.

To agree and paraphrase with some of the other messages,
I like the The for Matt Johnson
I like the Smiths for Johnny Marr.

Maybe it's just me, or just a stupid observation, but I think Matt
johnson is highly underrated as a guitarist. On Infected, he did a good
deal of the "guitaring", and that's a phenominal album (for many
reasons). I guess I want to know people's thoughts on the above
statement. Even you, Dave Hirsch.


- -------------------------------------------------------------------------
"And now he's swinging in the yard, he's the junior bard of the Juliard,
(P).J.- Moxy Frovous
___________________________________________________________________________




------------------------------
From: James Bykowy
To: "Pj aka Jack O'Showers"
cc: Infected
Subject: Re: Smiths/the The
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 20:06:20 -0600 (CST)
Message-ID:


Simple. Heard the The, loved it.
Couldn't even name a single Smiths tune...

James


"Thirty days has September, October, June, and February...
All the rest have thirty-one, except my brother,
Who got six months."
- Peter Sellers as "Hrundi V. Bakshi", The Party

------------------------------
From: Madhatter
To: James Bykowy
Cc: "Pj aka Jack O'Showers" ,
Infected
Subject: Re: Smiths/the The
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 00:56:44 -0500 (EST)
Message-Id:

On Tue, 7 Nov 1995, James Bykowy wrote:

>
> Simple. Heard the The, loved it.
> Couldn't even name a single Smiths tune...
>
> James
>
>
> "Thirty days has September, October, June, and February...
> All the rest have thirty-one, except my brother,
> Who got six months."
> - Peter Sellers as "Hrundi V. Bakshi", The Party
>
>
>

You don't know what you're missing. Although the styles and lyrics of
THE and The Smiths/Morrissey are rather different, they are both
brilliant in their own right. Please do yourself a favor a pick up
Strangeways Here We Come or Meat is Murder. You won't regret it!.
------------------------------
From: Douglas H Walker
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: gun sluts
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 1995 16:01:48 CST
Message-Id: <9511062201.AA06311@pv3455.vincent.iastate.edu>

- --------
I'm a new subscriber and was wondering if anyone knows a release
date for gun sluts.

Is the the still planning a Robert Johnson tribute album in the
future?

Looking forward to hearing from fellow the the fans.

Doug Walker
------------------------------
From: Hirschdave@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: kiss my white ass...
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 17:37:33 -0500
Message-ID: <951106173730_99482773@emout04.mail.aol.com>

so what have i done that is so wrong? my goodness, i come home from a boring
day at work and find myself in all sorts of emails.
first of all mr smitten, if that is your real name, i am very happy to have
the name of sodium light baby explained to me. i always just figured it was
one of those british things i didn't understand because i am not a pasty
pub-lovin' brit. so i bow my head to your wisdom. and i am sure you are
right. would it be so shocking if matt wrote another song about prostitutes?
now as far as the the, the smiths, and me, i really liked the smiths back in
high school. now mr smitten, i like to think i grew out of that kind of
contrived whining crap, but there are still times when that stuff is very
fun. i have no respect for morrissey as a singer or writer, but if you like
him, enjoy yourself, i don't give a flying fuck. and no one can fault marr as
a guitarist, i think he is very talented, it is just not my style, and i
would prefer it not mixing with music i love. but truth is that jack
o'showers (pj, have you lost your mind?) was right. the smiths are
delightful, if you like that sort of thing. and the the is delightful, but i
would prefer there be no connection between the two.
so the obvious answer to your question is no, i got into the the and the
smiths for different reasons, though at the same time, more or less. one has
just stuck around a lot longer.
and my first real purchase? that would have to be some sort of styx tape,
maybe grand illusion or paradise theater. i have always been a sucker for
that 70s art rock.
oh yeah, and matt is a great guitarist. thats him all over burning blue
soul, and that is pretty wonderful. he said in some interview that he uses
other people because he knows his limitations.
oops, i shouldn't say that. mr smitten will accuse me of knowing everything
again...poor jealous guy.
------------------------------
From: AmyCal@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: kiss my white ass...
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 18:45:03 -0500
Message-ID: <951106184502_99544550@mail02.mail.aol.com>

boy, you don't read your infected mail in a long while because you have to
wade through it and you miss all sorts of shit. that's what i get for being
intrigued by a subject title. now i have to read everything and figure out
what this is all about.
------------------------------
From: Graham Moore
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: kiss my white ass...
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 10:05:20 +0000 (GMT)
Message-ID: <9511071005.aa00750@scott.sco.com>


>From scol.london.sco.com!sco.sco.com!cs.cs.uchicago.edu!cs.uchicago.edu!behfar Mon Nov 6 23:30:51 1995
>From: Hirschdave@aol.com
>Date: Mon, 6 Nov 1995 17:37:33 -0500
>Message-ID: <951106173730_99482773@emout04.mail.aol.com>
>To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
>Subject: kiss my white ass...

>so what have i done that is so wrong? my goodness, i come home from a boring
>day at work and find myself in all sorts of emails.
>first of all mr smitten, if that is your real name, i am very happy to have
>the name of sodium light baby explained to me. i always just figured it was
>one of those british things i didn't understand because i am not a pasty
>pub-lovin' brit. so i bow my head to your wisdom. and i am sure you are
>right. would it be so shocking if matt wrote another song about prostitutes?

[ smiths stuff deleted ]

Perhaps it is just one of those British things. Till Sodium Light Baby I
had not heard of the term but I did come to the same conclusion that it was
about prostitution once I had heard the lyrics for the first time. Either
that or I have particularly twisted mind.

Graham
------------------------------
From: marice@students.wisc.edu (elvis)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: MJ/POT/marr..the smiths.et. al
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 20:45:05 +0700
Message-Id:

arrgh! i like the the...mostly because i fell in love with them when i saw
them live three years ago BY ACCIDENT and then borrowed mindbomb from my
sister because sinead was on it....

as for smoking bowls....hmpfh!...anyone out there as big of a clean cut
geek as me?..i'm straight-edged...sorry folks..not my groove thang..

as for the smiths...euch! Johnny marr did not make either the smiths or
the The...what makes both so fucking powerful is their LYRICS...the good
gutarist is just a bonus.
- -elvis...the omnipotent

------------------------------
From: Douglas H Walker
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Favorite lyrics
Date: Tue, 07 Nov 1995 13:44:19 CST
Message-Id: <9511071944.AA08987@pv3455.vincent.iastate.edu>

When the Infected LP came out in 1985, the first time I heard it the
music blew me away. Then I started listening to the lyrics and
realized that MJ was expressing the same feelings of confusion,
depression, loneliness, and lack of identity that I was feeling at
the time. I was a freshman in college and Infected became the
soundtrack to my life over the next four years.

Favorite lyrics from Infected:

There'll be no sleep 'til morning,
There'll be no lullaby,
Because Death had borrowed my clothes tonight.

-Out of the Blue


One day I asked the angels for inspiration,
But the Devil bought me a drink.

and

I never said I was the man I appeared to be.
Not the flesh wrapped around the bones of necessity,
Or the soul on fire scribbling thoughts for posterity.

-The Mercy Beat


Walker
------------------------------
From: Douglas H Walker
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Scenes from 'Arctic Twilight'
Date: Tue, 07 Nov 1995 13:48:59 CST
Message-Id: <9511071949.AA08995@pv3455.vincent.iastate.edu>


I have the Slow Emotion Replay single CD which also contains Scenes
>From 'Arctic Twilight' Parts I-V. It's five short minimalistic
instrumentals similar to some of Eno's work. Judging by the sound
and title I suspect it to be background music for something. Anyone
know? Any info on this would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Walker
------------------------------
From: djelline@haverford.edu (David M. Jellinek)
To: Douglas H Walker
Cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Scenes from 'Arctic Twilight'
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 1995 15:50:57 -0500
Message-Id:

>I have the Slow Emotion Replay single CD which also contains Scenes
>From 'Arctic Twilight' Parts I-V. It's five short minimalistic
>instrumentals similar to some of Eno's work. Judging by the sound
>and title I suspect it to be background music for something. Anyone
>know?

>From Dawn to Dusk video, I believe.

Dave

- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The vice of our times indeed appears to be that nothing is so firm as that
it could not be uprooted, nothing so certain that it could not be disputed,
and nothing so sacred that it could not be violated."

Philippe Duplessis-Mornay, 1579


David Jellinek
djelline@haverford.edu
610-642-5511

------------------------------
From: manifest@manifesto.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: TOM WAITS TRIBUTE ALBUM
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 01:56:49 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511080856.BAA18397@usr5.primenet.com>

Manifesto Records announces the release of album "Step Right Up: The
Songs of Tom Waits," which has been released worldwide (on November 7, 1995).

The full line-up for the album is as follows:

DRUGSTORE "Old Shoes"
TINDERSTICKS "Mockin' Bird"
PETE SHELLEY "Better Off Without A Wife"
THE WEDDING PRESENT "Red Shoes by the Drugstore"
VIOLENT FEMMES "Step Right Up"
ALEX CHILTON "Downtown"
ARCHERS OF LOAF "Big Joe and Phantom 309"
THESE IMMORTAL SOULS "You Can't Unring a Bell"
JEFFREY LEE PIERCE "Pasties and a G-String"
MAGNAPOP "Christmas Card from a Hooker in Minneapolis"
DAVE ALVIN "Ol' 55"
PALE SAINTS "Jersey Girl"
TIM BUCKLEY "Martha"
FRENTE! "Ruby's Arms"
10,000 MANIACS "I Hope That I Don't Fall In Love With You"


The album is out in the U.S. and Canada through Caroline
Distribution, and in U.K., Europe, and Australia through Virgin Records.

For further information, please visit our web site at
http://www.manifesto.com/manifesto/.



------------------------------
From: "vickie ellis"
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: kingdom of rain video
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 17:20:32 EST5EDT
Message-Id:

Greetings infecteds,

Does anyone know how to get a copy of the 'Kingdom of Rain' video?
I've only seen a 15-second clip of it, back when Mind Bomb first came
out, but have never seen anything on it since.

Also, on the subject of which theThe lyric best sums up your
life, it's been very interesting reading ..strange to realize there
are other people who love and relate to the exact same lyrics that I
do..especially since I don't know anyone at all where I live who even
knows who Matt (or the The) is....

Here are some others that hit home with me...

"..in this great city, of great solitude"

"..we are shoved down on our knees, to worship or to damn"

"could God really be so cruel, to give us feelings that could never
be fulfilled..":

well there's many more, but I just cant seem to get anything done with work
interrupting all the time !

- -vickie
------------------------------
From: Smitten123@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Why Dave is full of shit (as usual)...
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 23:50:27 -0500
Message-ID: <951108234941_17086929@emout04.mail.aol.com>



I believe it went something like this:
"how the hell could anyone listen to girlfriend in a coma or unhappy birthday
and take the guy seriously? and really, matt johnson doesn't have too many
songs about his clothing not being up to social standards."

Please, let us examine this.

1) The smiths released more albums, in (approx.) a five year period, than
matt has during his entire career. If the smiths had sat on an album for a
decade (as matt seems to do) then they probably would have looked back, and
not released a few songs.
Big fucking deal. I'd rather have more songs/albums and be able to pick out
what I liked than have to deal with an album every five years.

2) Matt does have a few bad songs. His B-sides are at times...childish. I
could get some five year old, put a few pots/pans and a spoon down in front
of it, and end up with better music. Really, he doesn't even have that many
b-sides, which supports the point above.

3) The smiths/Morrissey have a lot of variety. Look at the lyrics/music for
"london", then "how soon is now", then "meat is murder", then "suffer little
children", then "money
changes everything"......lots of variety. Matt sings
about.......relationships. Then, he sings about relationships. Finally, he
sings about shitty relationships. Sure, he does a damn good job of it, but
please. The worst part of it all is that "Mr. Hirschdave" posts that crap
when HE'S THE ONE that ridicules Matt for doing something different (ie
"lonely planet")

Piss off, tosser!

JaY (err, "MR. SMITTEN")

------------------------------
From: AmyCal@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Why Dave is full of shit (as usual)...
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 00:11:33 -0500
Message-ID: <951109001129_101891179@emout05.mail.aol.com>

can't we just all get along?
lets just say that they are different bands and you can like them for
different reasons and we are all entitled to our opinions. okay? okay.
now we can stop personally attacking people. and continue to enjoy
eachother's commentary. ha ha ha ha.
------------------------------
From: marice@students.wisc.edu (elvis)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Why Dave is full of shit (as usual)...
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 23:54:37 -0600
Message-Id:

SAID SIR SMITTEN< POTTY MOUTH EXTRAORDINAIRE!:

>I believe it went something like this:
>"how the hell could anyone listen to girlfriend in a coma or unhappy birthday
>and take the guy seriously? and really, matt johnson doesn't have too many
>songs about his clothing not being up to social standards."
>
>Please, let us examine this.
>
>1) The smiths released more albums, in (approx.) a five year period, than
>matt has during his entire career. If the smiths had sat on an album for a
>decade (as matt seems to do) then they probably would have looked back, and
>not released a few songs.
>Big fucking deal. I'd rather have more songs/albums and be able to pick out
>what I liked than have to deal with an album every five years.

wait...let me get this straight...you'd rather buy CRAP then wait and buy
something that is actually WORTH the money you're paying for it?!?! sheesH!
i LIKE the The because they take so much time to do the new stuff....they
don't release the petty CRAPOLA that they wouldn't want us, the consumer,
to buy....sure they DO have some stuff that I don't like...but someone else
out there does like it and that's why it got released.........
>
we'll just skip number two...cause it was balogna!

>3) The smiths/Morrissey have a lot of variety. Look at the lyrics/music for
>"london", then "how soon is now", then "meat is murder", then "suffer little
>children", then "money
>changes everything"......lots of variety. Matt sings
>about.......relationships. Then, he sings about relationships. Finally, he
>sings about shitty relationships. Sure, he does a damn good job of it, but
>please. The worst part of it all is that "Mr. Hirschdave" posts that crap
>when HE'S THE ONE that ridicules Matt for doing something different (ie
>"lonely planet")
>
what's wrong with singing about relationships and shitty ones at
that...that's something HE can relate to artistically, and almost everyone
in the world can relate to mentally....sheesH! i'd rather her about
relationships then some of the SHIT morrisey goes off on......

>Piss off, tosser!

you are not a nice boy....go awaY!


- -elvis

------------------------------
From: Madhatter
To: elvis
Cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Why Dave is full of shit (as usual)...
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 01:31:27 -0500 (EST)
Message-Id:

On Wed, 8 Nov 1995, elvis wrote:

> SAID SIR SMITTEN< POTTY MOUTH EXTRAORDINAIRE!:
>
> >I believe it went something like this:
> >"how the hell could anyone listen to girlfriend in a coma or unhappy birthday
> >and take the guy seriously? and really, matt johnson doesn't have too many
> >songs about his clothing not being up to social standards."
> >
> >Please, let us examine this.
> >
> >1) The smiths released more albums, in (approx.) a five year period, than
> >matt has during his entire career. If the smiths had sat on an album for a
> >decade (as matt seems to do) then they probably would have looked back, and
> >not released a few songs.
> >Big fucking deal. I'd rather have more songs/albums and be able to pick out
> >what I liked than have to deal with an album every five years.
>
> wait...let me get this straight...you'd rather buy CRAP then wait and buy
> something that is actually WORTH the money you're paying for it?!?! sheesH!
> i LIKE the The because they take so much time to do the new stuff....they
> don't release the petty CRAPOLA that they wouldn't want us, the consumer,
> to buy....sure they DO have some stuff that I don't like...but someone else
> out there does like it and that's why it got released.........
> >
> we'll just skip number two...cause it was balogna!
>
> >3) The smiths/Morrissey have a lot of variety. Look at the lyrics/music for
> >"london", then "how soon is now", then "meat is murder", then "suffer little
> >children", then "money
> >changes everything"......lots of variety. Matt sings
> >about.......relationships. Then, he sings about relationships. Finally, he
> >sings about shitty relationships. Sure, he does a damn good job of it, but
> >please. The worst part of it all is that "Mr. Hirschdave" posts that crap
> >when HE'S THE ONE that ridicules Matt for doing something different (ie
> >"lonely planet")
> >
> what's wrong with singing about relationships and shitty ones at
> that...that's something HE can relate to artistically, and almost everyone
> in the world can relate to mentally....sheesH! i'd rather her about
> relationships then some of the SHIT morrisey goes off on......
>
> >Piss off, tosser!
>
> you are not a nice boy....go awaY!
>
>
> -elvis
>
>
>

While I think Matt writes about more than just relationships (i.e.
religion, social issues, etc.) I agree with the observation concerning
the lengthy wait between Matt's albums. I mean, The Smiths put out
albums on a consistent basis, and NONE of them were crap. They were all
brilliant, albeit, some more brilliant than others. In fact, there are
maybe two songs by the Smiths that I don't like. (BTW, not only did they
put out albums quickly, and well, but Louder than Bombs is over 70
minutes long, I believe...Matt's latest, which took years to make, is
just over half an hour) Currently, Morrissey has expanded to talk about
all sorts of different topics...his new stuff could hardly be called
whining.
I'm not trying to put down MJ, and I know this news group in general
probably prefers THE (my roots lie in The Smiths, however), and I am an
avid fan of THE's work, but to call the Smiths crap is a HUGE
error...maybe you don't like the music, but, if you don't like Mozart or
Pink Floyd (I bet you've never heard these two names in one sentence
before!) does it suddenly become crap. It's sublime art, folks, plain
and simple!
------------------------------
From: Steven W Hill
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Why Dave is full of shit (as usual)...
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 95 10:43:55 CST
Message-Id: <9511091644.AA04343@harper.cc.il.us>

> maybe two songs by the Smiths that I don't like. (BTW, not only did they
> put out albums quickly, and well, but Louder than Bombs is over 70
> minutes long, I believe...Matt's latest, which took years to make, is
> just over half an hour) Currently, Morrissey has expanded to talk about

Wasn't LOUDER THAN BOMBS a compilation of already released songs?
And what makes you say Matt (Johnson)'s latest took years to make? I seem
to recall that in his earlier days, Matt Johnson would claim he was
"retiring" after every album. A four-year gap doesn't necessarily mean it
took four years to do the next album.

> all sorts of different topics...his new stuff could hardly be called
> whining.

Whining in his lyrics or in his voice? I can listen to Morrissey's
singing now, in fact I do have something like 7 Smiths/Morrissey albums,
but when I first heard him I couldn't stand his voice.

> I'm not trying to put down MJ, and I know this news group in general
> probably prefers THE (my roots lie in The Smiths, however), and I am an
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Might be because this is a mailing list for the The, not the Smiths.
The whole Smiths connection is so very tenuous anyway... one common band
member for a very short period of time. I sometimes wish Matt Johnson had
never asked Johnny Marr to join him. I cringed years ago during the Mind
Bomb tour when I heard someone telling a friend that he heard a song from
Johnny Marr's new band the The...

> avid fan of THE's work, but to call the Smiths crap is a HUGE
> error...maybe you don't like the music, but, if you don't like Mozart or
> Pink Floyd (I bet you've never heard these two names in one sentence

I'll agree with you there. I might only marginally like the Smiths, but
they're not crap. I usually only call something "crap" if I'm trying to
irritate someone. :) I don't like Mozart either (but I love classical
music).
- -shill

PS I also think SO many of the songs Morrissey has written sound alike.
- --
[][] [][] Steve Hill, Network Communications Specialist, 708-925-6273
[] [] [] Harper College, 1200 W Algonquin Rd, Palatine IL 60067-7398
----shill@harper.cc.il.us----http://www.harper.cc.il.us----
[] [] [] "Lousy Smarch weather!"
[][] [][] personal:(http://www.idis.com/shill/index.htm)
------------------------------
From: marice@students.wisc.edu (elvis)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: the THE vs. morissey!
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 00:38:02 -0600
Message-Id:

i feel the need to explain....i don't hate the smiths...

i just meant that morissey releases a LOT of filler....the The doesn't...i
know that there exist certain good songs by the Smiths, and Morissey, but i
am partial to the The because i don't have to filter through all of the
filler to get to the good stuff....

yes, they are both respectable bands, and musicians, andi can appreciate
that....but at the same time...i like the The simply because i like getting
more for my money...arrrgh! i'm so capitalistic....

i suppose if i was to go out and buy something Morissey, or the Smiths did
it'd have to be a greatest hits compilation....because filler just doesn't
cut it with me...i don't care how often you release the stuff...
- -elvis

------------------------------
From: euroboy@postoffice.ptd.net (micah stupak)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: the THE vs. morissey!
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 20:18:58 -0500
Message-Id: <199511100118.UAA21034@ns1.ptd.net>

betcha mj could kick mozz's ass... :) but then marr might jump in and help
mj beat up morrissey, which could then lead to mozz's demented looking bass
player coming into the fray, but i personally feel that james eller could
kick most anybody's ass... this, however, may delay the release of the new
electronic album, and this may piss off bernie sumner, which may cause chris
lowe to whack him upside the head, cuz i can't see neil hurting ANYBODY, but
then peter hook might give chris a good clean knock with his bass to get
REVENGE :), cuz, as we all know, hook's the only one with any real talent in
new order (bernie can't sing live, gillian just learned how to play the
white keys for the last tour, and when was the last time you saw stephen
morris playing a complicated drum line? :) ), which would leave the other
two :) :) standing on the side, with arthur baker encouraging them to get
into it, but tbis would leave frankie knuckles in a bind, having remixed PSb
but being a friend of arthur, so...
damn, what a pointless post!
if i could only work in greasy ol' andy eldritch... :)
tenderspot of the daphne. :)
euroboy@postoffice.ptd.net
comedy is the last refuge of the nonconformist mind.
------------------------------
From: Brandon K Snavely
To: elvis
cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: in defense of the Smiths
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 15:27:57 -0500 (EST)
Message-ID:

> i feel the need to explain....i don't hate the smiths...
>
> i just meant that morissey releases a LOT of filler....the The doesn't...i
> know that there exist certain good songs by the Smiths, and Morissey, but i
> am partial to the The because i don't have to filter through all of the
> filler to get to the good stuff....

But that "filler", i.e...those unpolished songs, can often give the
listener a window into how the artist really works. MJ spends years
perfecting each and every aspect of his albums, and although I love his
work, it comes across to be a little "mechanical" (i.e...the Infected
album). Yes, the Smiths could go into the studio and write, record, and
mix an album in a two month period, which may have led to some filler
(i.e...un-perfected songs), but this also allows for a more "raw" sound.

Also, artists should take risks and try to stretch beyond their normal
bounds. Sometimes this results in CRAP, but sometimes this risk results
in GREAT STUFF! Sure, the Smiths do have many crappy songs (i.e.."Death
at one's Elbow", "Unhappy Birthday"), however, there is a *reason* why
they are considered one of the most important cult bands of the 80s!!

Could we put a rest to this line of discussion, and maybe stick to
talking about MJ and The The?

Freeze
bksst6+@pitt.edu
------------------------------
From: foxrean@nznet.gen.nz (foxrean@nznet.gen.nz)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: in defense of the Smiths
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 22:09:32 +1300
Message-Id: <199511100909.WAA17143@nznet.gen.nz>

>MJ spends years
>>perfecting each and every aspect of his albums, and although I love his
>>work, it comes across to be a little "mechanical" (i.e...the Infected
>>album).

I don't think so... I think he's wonderful... so much care taken to make
sure everything is as he wanted it to be.

Here's something important to note I thinkith I
*don't* think MJ does what he does for the public. I don't think he does it
for anyone other than himself. If you took some time to look up the real
meaning of "artistry", that line, I believe, would feature prominently.

A real artist is someone whome persues their art for their own sake, not for
the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow, and not for the sake of becoming
the focus of attention. An artist quietly goes about the business of trying
to please themselves. If others like it, that's all fine and well, if not,
who cares.... the artist was doing it for the sake of their own sanity to
begin with, it's a null topic.

I could be wrong, maybe Matt *does* do it for the money and the media... I
don't know his mind. All I know is what I want to believe and that is that
Matt is an artist of the purest nature. If someone came along and tried to
shatter that belief that means so much to me, I'd do my darndest to shoot
them down.


>yes...but perfect...like he actually gives a shit what he puts out....like
>he isn't out there just to make a quick buck by releasing stuff that
>stinks...
>
> Yes, the Smiths could go into the studio and write, record, and
>>mix an album in a two month period, which may have led to some filler
>>(i.e...un-perfected songs), but this also allows for a more "raw" sound.
>
>it allows them to put more money in their pockets, is what i think...

See the bit about artistry....

>>Also, artists should take risks and try to stretch beyond their normal
>>bounds. Sometimes this results in CRAP, but sometimes this risk results
>>in GREAT STUFF! Sure, the Smiths do have many crappy songs (i.e.."Death
>>at one's Elbow", "Unhappy Birthday"), however, there is a *reason* why
>>they are considered one of the most important cult bands of the 80s!!

Uh-oh... Major booboo... The mention of "cult bands" does nothing but bog
the argument down with media preconceptions of bands. If the media cannot
find a comfortable explanation as to why a band is popular, they tag it as
"cult". It's nothing but a face saving measure by people who don't
appreciate the band and don't want to risk loosing face by saying "what the
hell is this?"

>>in GREAT STUFF! Sure, the Smiths do have many crappy songs (i.e.."Death
>>at one's Elbow", "Unhappy Birthday"), however, there is a *reason* why

A crappy, lazy song is *still*, before anything else, a crappy, lazy song.
What's so endearing about crappy laziness? 90% of so called artists could
spin tunes like that without the bat of an eyelash.

>> Could we put a rest to this line of discussion, and maybe stick to
>>talking about MJ and The The?
>i think this is important....anyone else out there? i mean how many
>different aspect to the The are there? many....their link to the smiths is
>an important one...

Er... Excuse a wee couch gopher for putting his 2 cents worth in, but *what*
exactly is the problem here?

Matt Johnson *is* theThe. Remove Matt and you don't have a theThe. Remove
Marr and you still have a theThe.

How the hell can any of you hope to draw any comparison whatsoever when Matt
(the vital ingrediant) is missing from one side of the debate?

Admittedly, I'm not quite sure what I'm talking about, I've never even
listented to the Smiths, but goll-darn-it, I just don't see what all the
hubbub is about. theThe is theThe, and anything that isn't theThe, *isn't*
theThe.

Matt is incredibly diverse... There is not a single album I could place as
sounding like any of the others... the only link between any of them is the
cynicism, the artistry and the *feeling* behind them. I don't know about
y'all, but I'd be hard pressed to think of a fave artist whome managed to
come across so subtly different in each release.

\Om

===========================================================================
Sattelite, oh sattelite. Who sit's upon our skies.
How deep do you see when you spy into our lives..,? -theThe
Metro Online: +649-570-1029 foxrean@nznet.gen.nz
============================================================================
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: in defense of the Smiths
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 12:40:24 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511111940.MAA17379@getnet.com>

"I'd like to drop my trousers to the Queen, Every sensible schoolboy, will
know what I mean...."

Can we, uh, start talking about what this list is really about, please?

> Could we put a rest to this line of discussion, and maybe stick to
>talking about MJ and The The?

Amen to that!
------------------------------
From: marice@students.wisc.edu (elvis)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: in defense of the Smiths
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 09:36:16 +0700
Message-Id:


>Here's something important to note I thinkith I
>*don't* think MJ does what he does for the public. I don't think he does it
>for anyone other than himself. If you took some time to look up the real
>meaning of "artistry", that line, I believe, would feature prominently.

Yes, but the thing is, he came across an audience in this manner...and he
knows that WE like what he does when it is done to HIS taste...he would
feel guilty, i think, if he put CRAP out there...

>A real artist is someone whome persues their art for their own sake, not for
>the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow, and not for the sake of becoming
>the focus of attention. An artist quietly goes about the business of trying
>to please themselves. If others like it, that's all fine and well, if not,
>who cares.... the artist was doing it for the sake of their own sanity to
>begin with, it's a null topic.
>
AMEN!
- -elvis

------------------------------
From: marice@students.wisc.edu (elvis)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: in defense of the Smiths
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 14:58:28 -0600
Message-Id:

>> i feel the need to explain....i don't hate the smiths...
>>
>> i just meant that morissey releases a LOT of filler....the The doesn't...i
>> know that there exist certain good songs by the Smiths, and Morissey, but i
>> am partial to the The because i don't have to filter through all of the
>> filler to get to the good stuff....
>
> But that "filler", i.e...those unpolished songs, can often give the
>listener a window into how the artist really works.

arp! no....it just shows that morissey is more willing to put out CRAP to
make money.......argh!

MJ spends years
>perfecting each and every aspect of his albums, and although I love his
>work, it comes across to be a little "mechanical" (i.e...the Infected
>album).

yes...but perfect...like he actually gives a shit what he puts out....like
he isn't out there just to make a quick buck by releasing stuff that
stinks...

Yes, the Smiths could go into the studio and write, record, and
>mix an album in a two month period, which may have led to some filler
>(i.e...un-perfected songs), but this also allows for a more "raw" sound.

it allows them to put more money in their pockets, is what i think...

>
> Also, artists should take risks and try to stretch beyond their normal
>bounds. Sometimes this results in CRAP, but sometimes this risk results
>in GREAT STUFF! Sure, the Smiths do have many crappy songs (i.e.."Death
>at one's Elbow", "Unhappy Birthday"), however, there is a *reason* why
>they are considered one of the most important cult bands of the 80s!!
>

beyond normal bounds...okay...listen to all of the the THE albums you have
in chronological order, and tell me they didn't do some MAJOR boundary
bending there.....the only constant to the The has been Matt's wonderful
sexy voice which is ever present...the rest of the band has changed,
developed, taken influences......the smiths, when they broke up were still
on the same yummy kick they'd been on for years!

> Could we put a rest to this line of discussion, and maybe stick to
>talking about MJ and The The?
i think this is important....anyone else out there? i mean how many
different aspect to the The are there? many....their link to the smiths is
an important one...
- -elvis

------------------------------
From: Brandon K Snavely
To: elvis
cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: in defense of the Smiths
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 21:44:53 -0500 (EST)
Message-ID:

> > But that "filler", i.e...those unpolished songs, can often give the
> >listener a window into how the artist really works.
>
> arp! no....it just shows that morissey is more willing to put out CRAP to
> make money.......argh!
>
> MJ spends years
> >perfecting each and every aspect of his albums, and although I love his
> >work, it comes across to be a little "mechanical" (i.e...the Infected
> >album).
>
> yes...but perfect...like he actually gives a shit what he puts out....like
> he isn't out there just to make a quick buck by releasing stuff that
> stinks...
>
> Yes, the Smiths could go into the studio and write, record, and
> >mix an album in a two month period, which may have led to some filler
> >(i.e...un-perfected songs), but this also allows for a more "raw" sound.
>
> it allows them to put more money in their pockets, is what i think...

Hmmmm....there seems to be a re-occuring theme in your thinking.
Since when have artistic credibility and wealth had anything to do with
each other?

> > Could we put a rest to this line of discussion, and maybe stick to
> >talking about MJ and The The?
> i think this is important....anyone else out there? i mean how many
> different aspect to the The are there? many....their link to the smiths is
> an important one...

Yeah, but all you wanna do is bash the Smiths! If we can be mature in
discussing the MJ/Smiths connection, then I'm all for it.

freeze
bksst6+@pitt.edu
------------------------------
From: James Bykowy
To: elvis
cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: the THE vs. morissey!
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 01:39:48 -0600 (CST)
Message-ID:


Just a question... who really cares?

I mean, really.

James

"Thirty days has September, October, June, and February...
All the rest have thirty-one, except my brother,
Who got six months."
- Peter Sellers as "Hrundi V. Bakshi", The Party

------------------------------
From: "Mr R. Forster"
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Subject of Matt's lyrics - theThe vs smiths crap!
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 09:54:49 +0000 (GMT)
Message-Id: <199511090954.JAA27701@ash-32.liv.ac.uk>

Matt, does concentrate on relationships, but not just that...

Infected LP, songs about the decline of the western civilisation...
religion, aids and shit, angels of deception a song about a relationship...
bollocks...

Mind Bomb LP, Armegeddon Days - song about relationship....

et al...

after johnny left the smiths, they went shit, broke up, morrisey, released
some solo lps, they bombed, both critically and commercially,
and johnny had sense and went to work with a real musician, now Morrisey
is supporting david bowie on his uk tour...

the only dangerous thing morrisey ever tried was playing with fascist
imagery, the union jack incident at the madness reunion concert,
national front disco... publicity seeking excercises because his career
was going down the bin...

so to conclude the smiths are no more and thethe go on releasing
stronger and better music... end off

ps girlfriend in a coma (not a song about relationships) haha


------------------------------
From: Hirschdave@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: oh my poor wounded soul!
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 07:54:24 -0500
Message-ID: <951109075421_17253105@emout04.mail.aol.com>

once again i find myself being so viciously attacked, and again at the hands
of the evil mr. smitten! poor me, i must run off and console myself with
"that joke isn't funny anymore." because it is too close to home and all
that crap.
mr. smitten, and mr. behfar,(who at least knows how to write a decent defense
of something he likes, no joke), i want to apologize from the bottom of my
cold, cold heart for starting this nasty little argument, as well as heating
it up at every occasion.
and i also want to recommend a few artists, whom i feel portray depression
and sadness without the silly pretentiousness of morrissey...
nick drake, lisa germano, red house painters, american music club, seam, solo
lou barlow, even the cliche of old joy division...those and more have the
OFFICIAL DAVE HIRSCH SEAL OF APPROVAL! (which means a lot in these troubling
times.)
try them! maybe you will like them, and get a different perspective on
morrissey as well.
------------------------------
From: Behfar Bastani-Booshehri
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: oh my poor wounded soul!
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 15:17:07 -0600 (CST)
Message-Id: <199511092117.PAA02309@lily.cs.uchicago.edu>

Hirschdave@aol.com writes:
> mr. smitten, and mr. behfar,(who at least knows how to write a decent defense
> of something he likes, no joke), i want to apologize from the bottom of my
> cold, cold heart for starting this nasty little argument, as well as heating
> it up at every occasion.

no need to dave, that's why we're here :)

> and i also want to recommend a few artists, whom i feel portray depression
> and sadness without the silly pretentiousness of morrissey...
> nick drake, lisa germano, red house painters, american music club, seam, solo
> lou barlow, even the cliche of old joy division...those and more have the

i must back up the recommendations for germano, rhp, amc,
and joy division, and extend the anger/sadness list with new model army
and queensryche (old and new), which may be more removed from the
tastes of some listies. and add leonard cohen while we're at it.

on a different note, has anyone paid any amount of thought to the line
"..i want to live, but i ain't a big enough man to do anything other
than think.."?
maybe an ironic remark on excessive thinking vs letting go and just living?

behfar
------------------------------
From: AmyCal@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: oh my poor wounded soul!
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 22:24:59 -0500
Message-ID: <951109222455_82915621@emout04.mail.aol.com>

i thought the SEAL belonged to good housekeeping dave!
------------------------------
From: "Lisa J. Moran"
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: the discussion questions from aeons ago
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 00:20:45 +1030
Message-Id: <199511091350.AA15249@fred.cs.flinders.edu.au>

wading thru excess mail and discovered these questions, i guess they served
their purpose from all the mail i found waiting for me after a few wks away!
1. I live in Adelaide, South Australia, Australia et al
2. My profession - biochem student at Flinders university and student in general
3. hobbies- urm.....hunting round antique book stores, scam the government for
student grants, music and everything
4.fave the The possession is my cassette copy of Soul Mining because it has
the extra tracks ( 3 orange kisses etc etc ) which in my humble opinion are pretty darn brilliant and can't wait till one day i finally have them on CD!
------------------------------
From: "Lisa J. Moran"
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: more discussion...
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 00:27:30 +1030
Message-Id: <199511091357.AA15303@fred.cs.flinders.edu.au>

other music i listen to - bowie, underground lovers, nick cave, cure, talking heads, mike oldfield, the church, pink floyd, crowded house, early U2, beatles, blackeyed susans, joy divison, new order, whiplash, and whatever else i can't remember
------------------------------
From: Douglas H Walker
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: the The vs the Smiths
Date: Thu, 09 Nov 1995 11:35:28 CST
Message-Id: <9511091735.AA13873@pv3455.vincent.iastate.edu>

Let's look past the lyrics for a minute and look at the music of the
The vs the music of the Smiths.

I own Rank, the live CD from the Smiths. It's a good CD, and I love
listening to Johnny Marr's guitar, but if it weren't for the pauses
between tracks, I don't know if I could tell when one song ended and
the next began. The Smiths were pretty much one trick ponies.
Every tune had Johnny Marrs distinctive guitar, and Morrissey's
distinctive voice and style. If you're into their sound, and love
to listen to the same song over and over again, then great, but
compare that to the variety of styles MJ has worked in. After the
success of Infected, The The could have easily released Infected II
and Infected III. Instead, he chose to experiment with different
sounds, eg the mideastern influences in Mind Bomb. On Dusk alone,
he had accoustic numbers (True Happiness. . . and Love Is
Stronger. . .), a gospel tune (Bluer Than Midnight), and an
incredibly haunting minimalistic piece (Lung Shadows). It is the
ease with which MJ goes from one style of music to another, making
each his own, that makes him one of the truly great creative
geniuses of our time.

-walker
------------------------------
From: Behfar Bastani-Booshehri
To: djelline@haverford.edu
Subject: Re: oh my poor wounded soul!
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 18:09:23 -0600 (CST)
Message-Id: <199511100009.SAA02369@lily.cs.uchicago.edu>

David M. Jellinek writes:
> >on a different note, has anyone paid any amount of thought to the line
> >"..i want to live, but i ain't a big enough man to do anything other
> >than think.."?
> >maybe an ironic remark on excessive thinking vs letting go and just living?
> >
> >behfar
>
> Was that a comment on recent musings (over thinkings) going on around your list?
> :-)

heh he.. yes. isn't that funny that these lyrics are
more versatile than they seem at first?
btw, you won't believe it, but people have unsubbed because
of these "recent musings". isn't that amusing? :)

take care dave..
behfar
------------------------------
From: Smitten123@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Love is stronger than Dave
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 21:03:45 -0500
Message-ID: <951109210344_17952255@mail02.mail.aol.com>



Hello happy infected people,


Don't you people realize that I was NOT the one that started this whole
Smiths vs. the The streak? We can all thank Dave for that.

And,
don't you people realize that Dave does what he does, deliberately? He
knows/plans in advance what type of reactions he is gonna get with the crazy
statements he makes. The point is that Dave and I do get along quite
well--contrary to what most of you must think. I just know when I'm dealing
with Dave to take everything he says with a grain of salt--and to punch right
back after I've been "hit."

I have a right to defend myself or any band I like. When someone posts a
message slamming me or one of my favorite bands then they can expect
retaliation.

To all of the people that wrote me and told me to get off of the list: Fuck
Off!!!
I noticed that most of those people were pretty new to the list. I've been
on here from the start and have no plans to leave. Really, I've done quite a
lot for this list and for the people on it. One minute people are begging
for my tapes and the next they hate me. How sad.

I wish people would read their mail a little better, maybe think about it
before posting. So many people that posted about the "Dave is full of..."
letter must have really bad reading comprehension problems--or out-right
lied. For example:

>From R.Forester:
"after johnny left the smiths, they went shit, broke up, Morrissey released
some solo lps, they bombed, both critically and commercially, and johnny had
sense and went to work with a real musician..."
This is an absolute lie. Almost all of Morrissey's lps have been given
excellent reviews (I can get out all of my NME's, Rolling Stones, Spin,
Melody Makers, etc and prove this), and he did quite well commercially too
(see Billboard magazines). Johnny didn't "have sense," he wandered tearfully
into an old friends camp. See the interviews for proof.

>From Marice:
"wait...let me get this straight...you'd rather buy crap then wait and buy
something that is actually worth the money you're paying for it."
Not what I said at all. I said that I would like for the band to give me all
the ideas they have for an album, including a couple of potentially bad ones,
so that I can decide what's good myself. Big difference.

"I like the The because they take so much time to do the new stuff..."
I hope you like them for the music. Time shouldn't matter. If they could
make an album in two days you wouldn't like it better if it took them ten
years.

In reference to the The:"but someone else out there does like it and that's
why it got released..." I hope that this applies to the Smiths as well!

"what's wrong with singing about relationships and shitty ones at
that...that's something He can relate to artistically, and almost everyone in
the world can relate to mentally..."
Again, I never said it was wrong to sing about relationships. Bamm, right
over your head. I just said that he sings about that stuff too much, got it?
Damn, READ SLOWLY or something. I said that because if you think about what
central theme is present in all of Matt's masterpieces--it's shitty
relationships. A number of the The songs have gotten me through rough
relationship problems. I love them, but Matt can do so much more (and sorta
has--but not enough).

>From adam:
"if the smiths are so much better than the The, take yourself off of the damn
mailing list."
Adam, Adam, Adam. I NEVER said that the Smiths were "so much better." Never,
Never, Never. I just defended the Smiths after they were called shit. CAN
YOU READ?
I love the The. I love the Smiths. Yes, it is possible to love both.
Different groups, different styles, different strengths.


Now, would I be on this list if I didn't like the The?
Well then.
"OFFICIAL DAVE HIRSCH SEAL OF APPROVAL" ?
No comment.


JaY




------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Love is stronger than Dave
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 12:52:09 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511111952.MAA18328@getnet.com>

>
>
>Hello happy infected people,
>
>
>Don't you people realize that I was NOT the one that started this whole
>Smiths vs. the The streak? We can all thank Dave for that.
>
>And,
>don't you people realize that Dave does what he does, deliberately? He
>knows/plans in advance what type of reactions he is gonna get with the crazy
>statements he makes. The point is that Dave and I do get along quite
>well--contrary to what most of you must think. I just know when I'm dealing
>with Dave to take everything he says with a grain of salt--and to punch right
>back after I've been "hit."

There are about 3 or 4 different "Daves" on this list, so please be clear
about whom you are talking, ok? I'm supposing it's Hirschdave, but
I don't know for sure, and I'd rather not assume.

>I have a right to defend myself or any band I like. When someone posts a
>message slamming me or one of my favorite bands then they can expect
>retaliation.
>
>To all of the people that wrote me and told me to get off of the list: Fuck
>Off!!!
>I noticed that most of those people were pretty new to the list. I've been
>on here from the start and have no plans to leave. Really, I've done quite a
>lot for this list and for the people on it. One minute people are begging
>for my tapes and the next they hate me. How sad.

Are you the same as PJ Kastner? I'm confused. Either way, I don't
think anyone should leave the list over a little (what I thought was
tounge in cheek) fighting. Isn't everybody blowing this
out of proportion? Maybe the relatively new people on the list
didn't understand it was mostly a joke....wasn't it?

Anyways....come on, people, relax already!
------------------------------
From: dougcha
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: RE: Love is stronger than Dave
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 95 21:23:41 PST
Message-Id: <9511100525.AA04310@netmail2.microsoft.com>

Ha, ha ha ha!!! I think the whole thing has been hilarious!

I think we all agree that we like The The or we wouldn't be on here.
If *I* had to pick one (1) favorite band, it would be The The, but that
doesn't mean that The The has to be *the* favorite band of everybody on
this list. Would that mean that we were only allowed to subscribe to
*one* music mailing list -- that of our *one* favorite band? Come on!

I've noticed that alot of people on here (actually everywhere) get
offended easily when you start trashing their favorite band. If you
like the Smiths, great, enjoy them, but don't try to convince me that
they're "better" than my favorite band (which I realize you didn't do,
Jay). Or if you hate the Smiths, great, but don't try to convince me
that they're shitty and I shouldn't listen to them. I think the whole
thing was started kind of "tongue in cheek" anyway.

OK, I'll let you all get back to listenning to the The and the Smiths
now, and I'll put on my asbestos (flame retardent) suit. :-)

Doug


------------------------------
From: Hirschdave@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: love conquers all...
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 22:22:46 -0500
Message-ID: <951109222245_102739777@mail04.mail.aol.com>

there are people on this list who wanted our dear mr smitten thrown off?
right, lets throw the bum out! i'll start a petition. damn, the guy makes
me seem like some evil mastermind. he's evil and he lies, and if he should
die, i might feel slightly sad but I WON'T CRY!


------------------------------
From: uthelene@ix.netcom.com (Sharkless girl )
To: Smitten123@aol.com
Cc: infected@CS.uchicago.edu
Subject: RE:love conquers all...
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 14:35:39 -0800
Message-Id: <199511102235.OAA19791@ix2.ix.netcom.com>

You wrote:
>
>
>
>Well, all you infected people, I suppose it's time to let you in on
the big
>secret. Dave and I cooked this whole thing up. Got ya! We were
talking the
>other day and he was like "there are so many smiths fans on this
list." So I
>said "yeah, I'm one of them. So what?" Well, it went on and on and
we
>realized that a few snide remarks b/w us could get some real action
going
>around here. What do ya know, it worked!
>
>So now, "all you simple folks"....so lead-able! Take a good look at
how easy
>it is to get you going.
>
>Oh, there were a few serious things that stay:
>The Dave Hirsch seal of approval
>
>and now:
>
>The "accepted by the American Smitten Association" which is of course
>supported by Consumer Reports and the FDA.
>
>
>JaY
>
>
>
if this is true, you got me and got me good! i was laughing pretty
hard...ouch, but if it isn't true...grrrrrrrr

love and hugs never mind euthelene she's just passionate about theThe
and few 100 other things.
------------------------------
From: Smitten123@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: RE:love conquers all...
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 01:31:34 -0500
Message-ID: <951110013133_102876966@emout04.mail.aol.com>



Well, all you infected people, I suppose it's time to let you in on the big
secret. Dave and I cooked this whole thing up. Got ya! We were talking the
other day and he was like "there are so many smiths fans on this list." So I
said "yeah, I'm one of them. So what?" Well, it went on and on and we
realized that a few snide remarks b/w us could get some real action going
around here. What do ya know, it worked!

So now, "all you simple folks"....so lead-able! Take a good look at how easy
it is to get you going.

Oh, there were a few serious things that stay:
The Dave Hirsch seal of approval

and now:

The "accepted by the American Smitten Association" which is of course
supported by Consumer Reports and the FDA.


JaY

------------------------------
From: "ceylon@shadow.net"
To: "'infected@cs.uchicago.edu'"
Subject: Revenge....Dooh!
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 23:39:23 -0500
Message-ID: <01BAAEFD.D2F461A0@ppp-mia-102.shadow.net>


>REVENGE :), <~~~~Just wanted to know If I was the only sucker to pick =
this turkey out for Thanksgiving (this commentary is not for European =
audiences).

Eu will be a man someday ;D
------------------------------
From: "ceylon@shadow.net"
To: "'infected@cs.uchicago.edu'"
Subject: Marr...a fookin gain
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 1995 23:47:48 -0500
Message-ID: <01BAAEFD.D550A120@ppp-mia-102.shadow.net>

Smitten wrote:
>Johnny didn't "have sense," he wandered tearfully
>into an old friends camp. See the interviews for proof.

~~ Firstly, I have seen "the interviews". Secondly, Marr has been =
producing albums, a far more prestigous occupation than "hired hand." =
Nothing against Moz though, I think this new incarnation my prove to be =
very worthwhile.

~Infected.
P.s.-Let's kill this one before the mailbombs drop.
------------------------------
From: Marky Mark-the stud man
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: praise Jay
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 09:53:09 GMT0BST
Message-ID: <8B32B02514@fs1.art.man.ac.uk>

Thank you Jay! I mirror your thoughts. What's wrong with enjoying
The Smiths? I love the The as well, but I like them BECAUSE they're
different. That's the beauty of music: everyone has their own way of
making it.

Mark
****************************************
mfzx5mam@stud.man.ac.uk
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: me me me me me me me
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 07:27:51 -0701 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511101428.HAA14104@getnet.com>

Dearest infectants -

Happy Birthday to Me
Happy Birthday to Me
Nov. 8th was the day
I turned 24.

(oh well, it doesn't rhyme the way Hirschdave's did! So whaddaya want?)

------------------------------
From: Hirschdave@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: not so fast, buddy boy
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 17:07:34 -0500
Message-ID: <951110170400_83166363@mail06.mail.aol.com>

i wouldn't say that by taking an argument or discussion to this list means
that we planned the whole thing. mr. smitten and i were simply discussing
the lack of talent morrissey has, but there is only so much two people can
say on the subject. by saying that this argument was cooked up to stir up
trouble isn't accurate, and i think mr. smitten is simply trying to take a
little pressure off of himself. this whole thing came about because people
were talking about their favorite artists on this list, and i was lamenting
the fact that not too many people agreed with my tastes. nothing more
sinister than that.
would anyone like to change the subject now?
------------------------------
From: uthelene@ix.netcom.com (Sharkless girl )
Cc: infected@CS.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: not so fast, buddy boy
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 14:57:05 -0800
Message-Id: <199511102257.OAA26790@ix6.ix.netcom.com>

You wrote:
>
>i wouldn't say that by taking an argument or discussion to this list
means
>that we planned the whole thing. mr. smitten and i were simply
discussing
>the lack of talent morrissey has, but there is only so much two people
can
>say on the subject. by saying that this argument was cooked up to
stir up
>trouble isn't accurate, and i think mr. smitten is simply trying to
take a
>little pressure off of himself. this whole thing came about because
people
>were talking about their favorite artists on this list, and i was
lamenting
>the fact that not too many people agreed with my tastes. nothing more
>sinister than that.
>would anyone like to change the subject now?
>
okay, now i'm SO confused, doesn;t take much. but who to you who toy
with my affections. consider me surrendering and movin gon, geesh and
i thought this was for real. kinda like that NTV show, the real world,
only it isn't. i feel like i should ask for me money back...i know
what money
------------------------------
From: foxrean@nznet.gen.nz (foxrean@nznet.gen.nz)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: not so fast, buddy boy
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 14:25:52 +1300
Message-Id: <199511110125.OAA00393@nznet.gen.nz>

>i still can't believe that everyone got so caught up in this. and i only
>read the last few. >everybody take a big deep breath and go listen to
>whatever the hell you feel like instead of arguing about it. if we all liked
>the same things life wouldn't be very interesting now would it?
>i think we can definitely change the subject.

Oh jee... Thats only about the 7th plea for a change of
subject.

If no-one else is going to, then I will monitor>.

Does anyone know Matt's background? Where he grew up? Where he
learned to play?
What his interests are? What family he has? Kids? Wife? Who *he* listens to?
Er.. and such?

\Om
===========================================================================
You've gotta stay optimistic, It get's harder by the second.
We all know we're edging our way toward the end. -theThe
Metro Online: +649-570-1029 foxrean@nznet.gen.nz
============================================================================
------------------------------
From: AmyCal@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: not so fast, buddy boy
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 20:02:58 -0500
Message-ID: <951110200255_103473339@mail02.mail.aol.com>

i still can't believe that everyone got so caught up in this. and i only
read the last few. everybody take a big deep breath and go listen to
whatever the hell you feel like instead of arguing about it. if we all liked
the same things life wouldn't be very interesting now would it?
i think we can definitely change the subject.
------------------------------
From: uthelene@ix.netcom.com (Sharkless girl )
To: infected@CS.uchicago.edu
Subject: Fwd: Why Dave is full of shit (as usual)...
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 14:14:31 -0800
Message-Id: <199511102214.OAA29125@ix5.ix.netcom.com>

Smitten wrote:

>I believe it went something like this:
>"how the hell could anyone listen to girlfriend in a coma or unhappy
>birthday and take the guy seriously? and really, matt johnson doesn't
>have too many songs about his clothing not being up to social
>standards."

first all i agree with hirshdave, girlfirend in the coma reaches the
epitemy of stupidty. hands down, the only worse I've heard is some of
the death metal i've been subjected to by a friend.

>Please, let us examine this.

>1) The smiths released more albums, in (approx.) a five year period,
>than matt has during his entire career. If the smiths had sat on an
>album for a decade (as matt seems to do) then they probably would have
>looked back, and not released a few songs. Big fucking deal. I'd
>other have more songs/albums and be able to pick out what I liked than
>have to deal with an album every five years.

And i would have have quality than quantity anyday. Seems like you're
willing to sacrifice integreity so you can buy more CDs...

>2) Matt does have a few bad songs. His B-sides are >at
times...childish. I could get some five year old, put a few pots/pans
>and a spoon down in front of it, and end up with better music.
>?Really, he doesn't even have that many b-sides, which supports the
>point above.

And now I suppose you "hate" children...And I suppose you could do
better, have it. We eagerly anticipate your release every year with
quality material and really cool B-sides. We're waiting.


>3) The smiths/Morrissey have a lot of variety. Look at the
>lyrics/music for "london", then "how soon is now", then "meat is
>murder", then "suffer little children", then "money changes
>everything"......lots of variety. Matt sings
>about.......relationships. Then, he sings about relationships.
>Finally, he sings about shitty relationships. Sure, he does a damn
>good job of it, but please. The worst part of it all is that "Mr.
>Hirschdave" posts that crap when HE'S THE ONE that ridicules Matt for
>doing something different (ie "lonely planet")

Never thought dave was ridiculing matt...you are reaching here too.
Matt sings about life, morrisey just whines about life. Whiners tend
to really piss me off, especially whiners who make 1000 times more
money in one year what I will make in my life.

>Piss off, tosser!
>JaY (err, "MR. SMITTEN")

no wonder people give AOLers a hard time, whatta whiner, and so polite.
Consider this the first and hopefully only flame to anyone that dares
to frequent the infected list with such a pissy attitide.

euthelene, who is always a hirshdave fan.

------------------------------
From: "P.J. Peterson"
To: Infected
Subject: Hirschdave
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 1995 17:51:29 -0500 (EST)
Message-Id:


Well, well, well. How intersting. How's about we start about the
OFFICALLY OFFICAL DAVE HIRSCH FAN CLUB, (with his seal of approval), of
course.

You're right, Dave, I think I've lost my mind
PJ

- -------------------------------------------------------------------------
"I'm a born-again agnostic."-- Matt Johnson
___________________________________________________________________________




------------------------------
From: foxrean@nznet.gen.nz (foxrean@nznet.gen.nz)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: merrily mixing
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 12:58:23 +1300
Message-Id: <199511102358.MAA31481@nznet.gen.nz>

Er, I was wondering if any one else had noticed how some, if not a lot of
the remixes are sort of decontructed versions of the original rather than
built on versions.

You know what I mean? In example: "This Is The Day" as released on er
Solitude seems to be a wheedled down version of the "This Is The
Day" that featured on Soul Mining. (I'm terribly fond of it all the same)

Oh hell, perhaps I'm just too used to listening to boppy remixes that take
the basic released track and try and build it into an epic.

Is the practice common though? after death" mumble mumble> Or am I imagining things?

\Om
===========================================================================
Sattelite, oh sattelite. Who sit's upon our skies.
How deep do you see when you spy into our lives..,? -theThe
Metro Online: +649-570-1029 foxrean@nznet.gen.nz
============================================================================
------------------------------
From: Brandon K Snavely
To: pandora@getnet.com
cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: discussion time.../Marr v. Schemerhorn
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 15:32:27 -0500 (EST)
Message-ID:

> Sometimes songs don't have to be serious to be enjoyable. I like
> "Girlfriend in a Coma" and other songs of his that aren't dead serious
> or have tons of social significance. Sometimes something just hits
> you the right way, has the right "hook" and you don't know why you like
> it. Even many of MJ's songs are like that too - the lyrics don't mean
> anything to me personally - or I may not even totally understand them -
> yet I still love it.

I agree that many (in fact, most) people think that songs don't have
to be serious to be enjoyable. It's ironic that "Girlfriend in a Coma"
is not one of these "meaningless" songs, though! In fact, most Smiths
songs have tons of social significance (listen to the entire "Meat is
Murder" album, or to individual songs such as "Sweet & Tender
Hooligan".).

freeze
bksst6+@pitt.edu
------------------------------
From: Behfar Bastani-Booshehri
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: forwarded message from pandora@getnet.com
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 14:33:36 -0600 (CST)
Message-Id: <199511112033.OAA03295@lily.cs.uchicago.edu>


i believe this was meant to go to the whole list..

From: pandora@getnet.com
To: behfar@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: discussion time.../Marr v. Schemerhorn

>Hirschdave@aol.com writes:
>> how the hell could anyone listen to girlfriend in a coma or unhappy birthday
>> and take the guy seriously? and really, matt johnson doesn't have too many
>> songs about his clothing not being up to social standards.

Sometimes songs don't have to be serious to be enjoyable. I like
"Girlfriend in a Coma" and other songs of his that aren't dead serious
or have tons of social significance. Sometimes something just hits
you the right way, has the right "hook" and you don't know why you like
it. Even many of MJ's songs are like that too - the lyrics don't mean
anything to me personally - or I may not even totally understand them -
yet I still love it.

Besides, not having your clothes meet up to social standards can
be very traumatic! :-)
------------------------------
From: pandora@getnet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: That joke isn't funny anymore
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 18:43:49 -0701 (MST)
Message-Id: <199511120144.SAA15093@getnet.com>

>once again i find myself being so viciously attacked, and again at the hands
>of the evil mr. smitten! poor me, i must run off and console myself with
>"that joke isn't funny anymore." because it is too close to home and all
>that crap.

And too near the bone, more than you'll ever know? :- )

Actually, that is a very beautiful, melancholy song....."You should know,
time's tide will smother you....and I will too.....I've seen this
happen, in other people's lives, now it's happening in mine...."
I will have to drag out "Meat is Murder" and listen to it again!

------------------------------
From: "Gordon C. Roadcap"
To: THE the
Subject: Get A Clue
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 1995 23:30:32 -0800 (PST)
Message-ID:

>"THE the is better than Morrissey."
>"Morrissey is better than THE the."
>"Is not."
>"Is to."
>"Is not."
>"Is to."
>"Is not."
>"Is TO."
>"Is NOT."
>"IS TO."
>"IS NOT."
>"IS TO!"
>"IS NOT!"
>"IS TO!" "IS NOT!" "IS TO!" "IS NOT!" IS TO!" "IS NOT!"

GET A FUCKING CLUE!!!! WHAT DOES IT MATTER.
------------------------------
From: Ray Finlay
Sender: mrvf100@cus.cam.ac.uk (M.R.V. Finlay)
To: "Gordon C. Roadcap"
cc: THE the
Subject: Re: Get A Clue
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 13:04:30 +0000 (GMT)
Message-ID:

On Sat, 11 Nov 1995, Gordon C. Roadcap wrote:

> >"THE the is better than Morrissey."
> >"Morrissey is better than THE the."
> >"Is not."
> >"Is to."
> >"Is not."
> >"Is to."
> >"Is not."
> >"Is TO."
> >"Is NOT."
> >"IS TO."
> >"IS NOT."
> >"IS TO!"
> >"IS NOT!"
> >"IS TO!" "IS NOT!" "IS TO!" "IS NOT!" IS TO!" "IS NOT!"
>
> GET A FUCKING CLUE!!!! WHAT DOES IT MATTER.
>
spot on my friend
------------------------------
From: marice@students.wisc.edu (elvis)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Get A Clue
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 12:38:05 -0600
Message-Id:

>On Sat, 11 Nov 1995, Gordon C. Roadcap wrote:
>
>> >"THE the is better than Morrissey."
>> >"Morrissey is better than THE the."
>> >"Is not."
>> >"Is to."
>> >"Is not."
>> >"Is to."
>> >"Is not."
>> >"Is TO."
>> >"Is NOT."
>> >"IS TO."
>> >"IS NOT."
>> >"IS TO!"
>> >"IS NOT!"
>> >"IS TO!" "IS NOT!" "IS TO!" "IS NOT!" IS TO!" "IS NOT!"
>>
>> GET A FUCKING CLUE!!!! WHAT DOES IT MATTER.
>>
>spot on my friend

'is to' is really spelled "is TOO"...i think you're the one who should get
a clue if you can't even spell what you're saying....silly boy!
- -elvis

------------------------------
From: James Bykowy
To: elvis
cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Get A Clue
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 00:39:25 -0600 (CST)
Message-ID:



> >> >"IS TO."
> >> >"IS NOT."
> >> >"IS TO!"
> >> >"IS NOT!"
> >> >"IS TO!" "IS NOT!" "IS TO!" "IS NOT!" IS TO!" "IS NOT!"
>
> 'is to' is really spelled "is TOO"...i think you're the one who should get
> a clue if you can't even spell what you're saying....silly boy!
> -elvis

Sweetheart, you're gonna die young if you stress out over all the people
who misspell words. A lesson I learned long ago. I'd much rather put up
with somebody misspelling "to" than receiving 35 pieces of email a day
about who's better.

James

"Thirty days has September, October, June, and February...
All the rest have thirty-one, except my brother,
Who got six months."
- Peter Sellers as "Hrundi V. Bakshi", The Party
------------------------------
From: "vickie ellis"
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: (Fwd) Re: Get A Clue
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 16:12:43 EST5EDT
Message-Id: <7E7A92936@titan.cc.emory.edu>


>On Sat, 11 Nov 1995, Gordon C. Roadcap wrote:
>
>> >"THE the is better than Morrissey."
>> >"Morrissey is better than THE the."
>> >"Is not."
>> >"Is to."
>
'is to' is really spelled "is TOO"...i think you're the one who should get
a clue if you can't even spell what you're saying....silly boy!
- -elvis
====================================================
Ya'll go on and argue all ya want, and make all the spelling
mistakes ya want, cause it's THANKSGIVING (almost)..and I'm just glad
we have Matt and the The on the planet with us to make us feel things
strongly enough to rise up out of our apathy and cynicism enough to argue!!!!
( supply your own music here)
This is great, ya'll!!!!! I for one haven't listened to the
Smiths/Morrissey, but now at last I know why, when asked who I was
listening to and replying 'theThe' , I always got the standard blank look, then
'So, do ya like Morrisey'?? (then of course, the offender got a
return blank look from me). I've never heard ANY human
who can get into my head like Matt does, so I'm fiercely loyal to him,
(satire mode entered)
but I'm secure in the knowledge that he is God, so no problem to me
with people who dont understand that.
(IEC161i - satire mode abended - system code S0C7)
Ya know also, it's way harder to interpret subtle meanings
and inflections behind the written word , so many times 'arguments'
are just misunderstandings, and why do people get so in a wad if ya
feel like arguing anyway? I mean, are they gonna spontaneously
combust or something?
On the new kinder and gentler subject, Matt's background, all I
know is that he lived over his parent's pub and was into music from
very early in his life..I have an album from his first (I guess?)
band, the Gadgets, and it is ..well...I'm not sure what it is.
And just what am I doing still here at work on a Sunday,
when I could be home watching much more interesting things!!!!
see ya'll..
vickie
p.s. dont start on me about 'ya'll', i just cant help it.

"You gotta work out your own salvation, with no explanation"
- the The

------------------------------
From: uthelene@ix.netcom.com (Sharkless girl )
From: "vickie ellis"
To: infected@CS.uchicago.edu
To: infected@CS.uchicago.edu
Subject: Fwd: (Fwd) Re: Get A Clue
Subject: (Fwd) Re: Get A Clue
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 16:12:43 EST5EDT
Message-Id: <7E7A92936@titan.cc.emory.edu>


>On Sat, 11 Nov 1995, Gordon C. Roadcap wrote:
delete huge chunk

On the new kinder and gentler subject, Matt's background, all I
know is that he lived over his parent's pub and was into music from
very early in his life..I have an album from his first (I guess?)
band, the Gadgets, and it is ..well...I'm not sure what it is.
And just what am I doing still here at work on a Sunday,
when I could be home watching much more interesting things!!!!
see ya'll..
vickie
p.s. dont start on me about 'ya'll', i just cant help it.

"You gotta work out your own salvation, with no explanation"
- the The

the gadgets was not one of Matt's bands, much more or less his first
band. He did some production work i believe and minimal production
work at that, maybe played on some tracks. The gadgets label just
plasters matt's name on stickers and stuff to get people to buy the
gadgets. his first band was called Roadstar which he formed at age 15,
i think.

and the ya'll thing is kinda cute.

euthelene who just re-read her volume 6 interview with matt
------------------------------
From: Madhatter
To: Sharkless girl ,
vickie ellis
Cc: infected@CS.uchicago.edu, infected@CS.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Fwd: (Fwd) Re: Get A Clue
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 19:58:37 -0500 (EST)
Message-Id:

On Sun, 12 Nov 1995, Sharkless girl wrote:

>
> >On Sat, 11 Nov 1995, Gordon C. Roadcap wrote:
> delete huge chunk
>
> On the new kinder and gentler subject, Matt's background, all I
> know is that he lived over his parent's pub and was into music from
> very early in his life..I have an album from his first (I guess?)
> band, the Gadgets, and it is ..well...I'm not sure what it is.
> And just what am I doing still here at work on a Sunday,
> when I could be home watching much more interesting things!!!!
> see ya'll..
> vickie
> p.s. dont start on me about 'ya'll', i just cant help it.
>
> "You gotta work out your own salvation, with no explanation"
> - the The
>
> the gadgets was not one of Matt's bands, much more or less his first
> band. He did some production work i believe and minimal production
> work at that, maybe played on some tracks. The gadgets label just
> plasters matt's name on stickers and stuff to get people to buy the
> gadgets. his first band was called Roadstar which he formed at age 15,
> i think.
>
> and the ya'll thing is kinda cute.
>
> euthelene who just re-read her volume 6 interview with matt
>
>


I know that MJ's parent's pub had all sorts of hooligans in it. Even the
Krays paid visits there!
------------------------------
From: DLT1977@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Web pages
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 12:04:31 -0500
Message-ID: <951112120428_83647024@mail06.mail.aol.com>

Could somebody please send me the address for the The's web page? I'm new to
the list and would appreciate it.



thanks,
Donnie
------------------------------
From: Smiley Boy
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Tape x-change (last chance)
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 16:23:06 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id:

No other people have signed up for the tape exchange in the last week.
Right now I have 8 names on the list. If you'd like to be a part of it
drop me a line at and I'll put you on. This
is your last chance (I really don't have the time to keep updating the
list so it will be a one shot deal only). If I get no further requests the
list will be out in about a week.

Be Well,
S.B. :)
_________________________________________________________________________
If I could choose the life I pleased
Then I would be a boatman
Along the canals and the rivers free
No hasty words are spoken
My only law the river breeze
Would take me to the open seas
-The Levellers
_________________________________________________________________________
------------------------------
From: Madhatter
To: Smiley Boy
Cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Tape x-change (last chance)
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 18:30:22 -0500 (EST)
Message-Id:

On Sun, 12 Nov 1995, Smiley Boy wrote:

> No other people have signed up for the tape exchange in the last week.
> Right now I have 8 names on the list. If you'd like to be a part of it
> drop me a line at and I'll put you on. This
> is your last chance (I really don't have the time to keep updating the
> list so it will be a one shot deal only). If I get no further requests the
> list will be out in about a week.
>
> Be Well,
> S.B. :)
> _________________________________________________________________________
> If I could choose the life I pleased
> Then I would be a boatman
> Along the canals and the rivers free
> No hasty words are spoken
> My only law the river breeze
> Would take me to the open seas
> -The Levellers
> _________________________________________________________________________
>
>

Sorry, but I must have missed the original post...what kind of tape
xchange? I'm always interested in getting THE material that I don't
have, so if it's material I don't have, I may be interested. Thanks.
------------------------------
From: uthelene@ix.netcom.com (Sharkless girl )
To: infected@CS.uchicago.edu
Subject: thanks to ?
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 16:11:00 -0800
Message-Id: <199511130011.QAA29190@ix12.ix.netcom.com>

I received a tape in the mail this past week. But the ink stamp on the
envelope has run, I couldn't read the return address. So to whomeever
sent me the tape THANKS! If I owe you money please contact me. I do
know that tape came from Canada...cheers euthelene
------------------------------
From: Hirschdave@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: gadgets
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 1995 22:29:07 -0500
Message-ID: <951112222754_20560491@emout04.mail.aol.com>

matt can say what he wants in interviews now, but there are a few gadgets
songs (5 or 6) that are very clearly him. and he is listed as a member of
the gadgets in the liner notes of the perspectives and distortion
compilation, which features a matt solo track that is credited as engineered
by a gadgets member, colin lloyd tucker. they did rip him off and exploit
his involvement, but he is definitely vocal and musical on a few tracks.
matts gadget stuff is from 79 and 80, very early stuff. but he completely
disowns it now.
------------------------------
From: "ceylon@shadow.net"
To: "'infected@cs.uchicago.edu'"
Subject: Thinking/Letting go &Greek food
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 02:46:47 -0500
Message-ID: <01BAB172.52242AC0@ppp-mia-45.shadow.net>

Behfar wrote:
>on a different note, has anyone paid any amount of thought to the line
>"..i want to live, but i ain't a big enough man to do anything other
>than think.."?
>maybe an ironic remark on excessive thinking vs letting go and just =
living?

~Yes, I too have pondered the lyric in question. I seem to be torn =
between the rationale that: 1) Over-analysis is bad, and 2) I think so =
fluffin much, my brain can't decipher up from down i.e. we provide the =
greatest barriers for ourselves.=20

~ I'm going to stretch my neck out and say that he's prodding at the =
dichotomy of mankind...good and evil...horny and Morrissey (I can't =
forgive myself for that one)...Ricky and Bianca (babooshka)...=20

~ Perhaps, everything I've asserted so far is total bollocks...It's =
repression, that stands in the way of freedom, fortitude and =
functionality (3 F's). This would hardly be inconcieveable as his =
perspective, as he is an Englishman.=20

*Thanks very much Behfar, for re-introducing that passage, among the =
many.

Missin the DAR,
Ian
------------------------------
From: foxrean@nznet.gen.nz (foxrean@nznet.gen.nz)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Thinking/Letting go &Greek food
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 22:36:19 +1300
Message-Id: <199511140936.WAA05065@nznet.gen.nz>

Behfar wrote:

>>on a different note, has anyone paid any amount of thought to the line
>>"..i want to live, but i ain't a big enough man to do anything other
>than think.."?

Doug Chase added:

>I always thought of it as meaning that he would sit around and think of
>all the things he'd like to do, but they involved some risk (doesn't
>everything?) and in the end he just ended up thinking about all those
>things, but never actually *doing* any of them.

*My* thoughts exactly.... I got the impression of this "lost & lonely"
person who would look on and envy the action around him but not join in from
fear or other emotional tie-strings, and suffices with just the thought of
what it would be like... feeling" :) >

\Om

------------------------------
From: AmyCal@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Thinking/Letting go &Greek food
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 00:00:23 -0500
Message-ID: <951114000021_84287795@emout05.mail.aol.com>

"Post Script: Mr. Elvis you seem so anal retentive that I imagine if a
chunk of coal was inserted into your ass, you would produce a diamond."

a ferris beuller fan!
------------------------------
From: Doug Chase
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Thinking/Letting go &Greek food
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 95 00:26:22 PST
Message-Id: <9511140830.AA27405@netmail2.microsoft.com>

Behfar wrote:

>on a different note, has anyone paid any amount of thought to the line
>"..i want to live, but i ain't a big enough man to do anything other
than think.."?

I always thought of it as meaning that he would sit around and think of
all the things he'd like to do, but they involved some risk (doesn't
everything?) and in the end he just ended up thinking about all those
things, but never actually *doing* any of them.

Doug

------------------------------
From: "Gordon C. Roadcap"
To: "ceylon@shadow.net"
cc: "'infected@cs.uchicago.edu'"
Subject: Re: Thinking/Letting go &Greek food
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 00:07:38 -0800 (PST)
Message-ID:



> Behfar wrote:
> >on a different note, has anyone paid any amount of thought to the line
> >"..i want to live, but i ain't a big enough man to do anything other
> >than think.."?
> >maybe an ironic remark on excessive thinking vs letting go and just living?

Yes, I think you are correct. I've always compared the lyric to Yeats'
idea that while he is creating life in verse, he is in effect missing
life in reality.
So when one is confronted with the Hamletesque problem between
action and thought, will one act and assume responsibility for his/her
actions, or will one first consider all actions and the possible reactions?
The speaker of Matt's song seems to fall into the latter.
Cheers,
Gordon.

Post Script: Mr. Elvis you seem so anal retentive that I imagine if a
chunk of coal was inserted into your ass, you would produce a diamond.
------------------------------
From: "Mr R. Forster"
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: My Homepage!
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 16:33:48 +0000 (GMT)
Message-Id: <199511131633.QAA06905@uxa.liv.ac.uk>

Hi all!

Come and visit my homepage, it has music, tv and movie,games
and other stuff

http://www.liv.ac.uk/~forster/new5.html

It has my own personal theThe page that I will be developing...

please drop by and let me know what u think ?

thanks....
------------------------------
From: "Roderich Heikenfeld"
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: My Homepage!
Date: Fri, 24 Nov 1995 10:56:03 +0100
Message-Id: <30b5976b4632002@sun529.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>

On 13 Nov 95 at 16:33, Mr R. Forster wrote:

> From: "Mr R. Forster"
> Subject: My Homepage!
> To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
> Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 16:33:48 +0000 (GMT)

> Hi all!
>
> Come and visit my homepage, it has music, tv and movie,games
> and other stuff
>
> http://www.liv.ac.uk/~forster/new5.html
>
> It has my own personal theThe page that I will be developing...
>
> please drop by and let me know what u think ?
>
> thanks....
>
>
Well, this homepage is so breathtaking, that is doesn=B4t exist!
Probably you posted a wrong adress.
Roderich =A4=A4=A4=A4 How can anyone =A4=A4=A4=A4
=A4=A4=A4=A4 know me =A4=A4=A4=A4
=A4=A4=A4=A4 when I don=B4t even know =A4=A4=A4=A4
=A4=A4=A4=A4 MYSELF =A4=A4=A4=A4
------------------------------
From: Douglas H Walker
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: MJ listens to. . .
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 11:50:43 CST
Message-Id: <9511131750.AA01719@pv343f.vincent.iastate.edu>

- --------
In reply to the query about what MJ listens to music wise, I read an
interview where MJ said he didn't listen to a lot of the current
music, but that his main influences are Hank Williams, Robert
Johnson, and John Lennon, the last two of which are the two
singer/songwriters I've heard mentioned as subjects of future theThe
tribute CDs. Pardon the run on.

-walker
------------------------------
From: Scott
To: "'EVERYONE ON THE LIST!'"
Subject: RE: MJ listens to. . .
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 15:00:09 -0600
Message-ID: <01BAB1DA.BD4C6FC0@steamer>

I was with this radio DJ when I met Matt, and she said, "so, what are =
you into musically? Any other bands you like?" He said,"there is only =
the The and classical music." His face looked exactly as it does on the =
Mind Bomb cover. He was not a happy camper. Johnny was into Riuichi =
Sakamoto, and he and I discussed the Edge's complimentary remarks about =
his work.

- ----------
From: Douglas H Walker[SMTP:dhwalker@iastate.edu]
Sent: Monday, November 13, 1995 11:50 AM
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: MJ listens to. . .

- --------
In reply to the query about what MJ listens to music wise, I read an
interview where MJ said he didn't listen to a lot of the current
music, but that his main influences are Hank Williams, Robert
Johnson, and John Lennon, the last two of which are the two
singer/songwriters I've heard mentioned as subjects of future theThe
tribute CDs. Pardon the run on.

-walker


------------------------------
From: Madhatter
To: Douglas H Walker
Cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: MJ listens to. . .
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 14:29:52 -0500 (EST)
Message-Id:

On Mon, 13 Nov 1995, Douglas H Walker wrote:

> --------
> In reply to the query about what MJ listens to music wise, I read an
> interview where MJ said he didn't listen to a lot of the current
> music, but that his main influences are Hank Williams, Robert
> Johnson, and John Lennon, the last two of which are the two
> singer/songwriters I've heard mentioned as subjects of future theThe
> tribute CDs. Pardon the run on.
>
> -walker
>

Well, I read that MJ never even heard Hank Williams until seim-recently,
and that he read a biography on him, with his life interesting him more
than his music.
------------------------------
From: "Paul Spiers"
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Relax
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 1995 21:47:13 +0000
Message-Id: <199511132152.VAA16076@oberon.wintermute.co.uk>

I think the list is suffering from a lack of new material from MJ,
commonly known here in Scotland as 'jingsfarsinewthethestuff!'

As a remedy I think we should all go home put all the lights off, put
on Soul Mining (using a torch if its dark). Open up a few Buds and
listen to possibly the best Album of our time at maximum volume.

Tomorrow you will feel much, much better.

Paul

Now where did I put that bottle opener?
------------------------------
From: Douglas H Walker
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Hello
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 11:15:14 CST
Message-Id: <9511141715.AA04590@pv343f.vincent.iastate.edu>

TheThe bad without Johnny Marr? Johnny Marr had very little
influence on theThe's music. Most of the time he played the role of
studio musician. I'm sure he contributed a little, but much less so
than someone like D.C. Collard. I don't even know if Johnny Marr
played on half of the tracks off Dusk and Hanky Panky. I like
Johnny, but his not playing with MJ will have no effect on the
quality of the music.

-walker
------------------------------
From: Douglas H Walker
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Hello
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 13:36:46 CST
Message-Id: <9511141936.AA04821@pv343f.vincent.iastate.edu>

While at home over lunch I checked my facts. Johnny Marr played on
eight of the ten tracks on Dusk, and didn't play at all on Hanky
Panky.

-walker
------------------------------
From: Douglas H Walker
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: my last 2 messages
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 13:55:55 CST
Message-Id: <9511141955.AA04882@pv343f.vincent.iastate.edu>

You may ignore my last two messages. They were replies for another
theThe mailing list. I mailed them to this one by mistake. Dopey
me.

-walker
------------------------------
From: Genepool@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: my last 2 messages
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 1995 08:24:49 -0500
Message-ID: <951115082448_107025755@emout05.mail.aol.com>

<theThe mailing list.

what other list?

Steve

*************************************************
genepool is the name of our band
*************************************************
------------------------------
From: Douglas H Walker
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: other theThe mail list
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 17:11:00 CST
Message-Id: <9511142311.AA25525@pv3455.vincent.iastate.edu>

I am ashamed to admit I have subscribed to another theThe mail list
behind your collective back. I am so ashamed. I don't know what
came over me. I hope you have it in your collective heart to
forgive this regular guy with bottled up insides. I didn't want to
hurt your feelings, but I couldn't supress my own.

Anyway, I subscribed to this other mail list last week and hadn't
gotten a single message until today. That's why the confusion as to
which list to reply. I just assumed the message was from this list.

Here's the address for the other list:

thethe-l-request@lists.io.com

Type: SUBSCRIBE thethe-l "your name"

Then to leave messages:

thethe-l@io.com

-walker

P.S. that's a lower case L after thethe- , not a one. It took me a
few tries to figure that one out. I'm not the sharpest tool in the
shed.
------------------------------
From: Brandon K Snavely
To: Douglas H Walker
cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: other theThe mail list
Date: Tue, 14 Nov 1995 23:26:51 -0500 (EST)
Message-ID:

Um, excuse me, but what is the purpose of having *two* lists for a
single band? I've never heard of this and cannot think of a reason why it
would be better to have two lists. Why doesn't someone just combine the
two lists?

freeze (Brandon Snavely, bksst6+@pitt.edu)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"One hand is tied, "We never-ever argue, we never calculate
One step gets behind The currency we've spent
In one breath we're dying" I love you, you pay my rent"
-Adrian Belew, King Crimson -Neil Tennant, Pet Shop Boys
------------------------------
From: euroboy@postoffice.ptd.net (micah stupak)
To: Joonas Virtasalo , infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: James Eller
Date: Thu, 16 Nov 1995 17:36:54 -0500
Message-Id: <199511162236.RAA10423@ns1.ptd.net>

>There has been a lot of discussion about Johnny Marr playing on the The
>album 'Dusk'. I still like James Eller more in bass than Marr in guitar.
>Marr was great, but still...
i agree! he's rather interesting live, too. :)

>Does anyone know what Eller did before 'Dusk'? Or what is he doing right now?
good question... anybody?
tenderspot of the daphne. :)
euroboy@postoffice.ptd.net
comedy is the last refuge of the nonconformist mind.
------------------------------
From: "Roderich Heikenfeld"
To: infected@CS.UChicago.edu
Subject: what MJ means to me
Date: Sun, 19 Nov 1995 18:30:38 +0100
Message-Id: <30af6a4c66cb002@sun529.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>

I got in touch with the The when I saw the video to "slow train to
dawn" on TV back in 1986. I bought Infected and loved it. MJ was my
special friend back in those teenage days when there seemed to be no
way out. Though i listen to a lot of other music, the The is still MY
favourite, as no other band could really touch my heart ( even not
the Smiths!).
Actually I don=B4t really like Hanky Panky, It doesn=B4t have that anger
indise, as those are not real MJ songs.
Roderich =A4=A4=A4=A4 How can anyone =A4=A4=A4=A4
=A4=A4=A4=A4 know me =A4=A4=A4=A4
=A4=A4=A4=A4 when I don=B4t even know =A4=A4=A4=A4
=A4=A4=A4=A4 MYSELF =A4=A4=A4=A4
------------------------------
From: Joonas Virtasalo
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: what MJ means to me
Date: Mon, 20 Nov 1995 08:05:33 +0200
Message-Id: <199511200606.IAA16333@jazz>

At 18:30 19.11.1995 +0100, you wrote:

>I got in touch with the The when I saw the video to "slow train to=20
>dawn" on TV back in 1986. I bought Infected and loved it. MJ was my=20

I got in touch with the The when I saw the video to 'Dogs of Lust'.

>Actually I don=B4t really like Hanky Panky, It doesn=B4t have that anger=20
>indise, as those are not real MJ songs.=20

I like Hanky Panky, but not as much as 'real' the The albums. Matt has given
Williams's songs a the The sound, but it still isn't the The.=20

On the sleeve of Hanky Panky album it stands that Gun Slots album is coming
out soon. Does anyone know anything about it? Is it going to be a Matt
Johnson album or another tribute album?=20

- -----------------------------------------------------------------------
Joonas Virtasalo, Satakunta Polytechnic, ADP-Department ! !
joonas@jazz.cc.spt.fi, http://www.spt.fi/~joonas ! !
- -----------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
From: Douglas H Walker
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu, thethe-l@io.com
Subject: Re: Top 10 albums
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 16:09:14 CST
Message-Id: <9511272209.AA03691@pv343f.vincent.iastate.edu>

I've noticed a slow down in mail recently, so I thought I'd try and
get a little discussion going. I've been listening to theThe for
over 10 years now, but have not known anyone else who is a regular
listener of theThe. I'm curious as to the listening tastes of other
theThe fans, and I'm always open to new bands or musical artists.
What are the 10 best albums in your opinion other than those
released by theThe. (We're all fans of his music). To get things
started, here's my list.

1) Talking Heads - The Name Of This Band Is The Talking Heads
2) The Clash - London Calling
3) The Rolling Stones - Exile On Main Street
4) Pink Floyd - The Wall
5) Talking Heads - Fear Of Music
6) Rolling Stones - Let It Bleed
7) U2 - Joshua Tree
8) The Clash - The Clash
9) The Replacements - Tim
10) Indigo Girls - Indigo Girls


Looking forward to reading your lists,

walker
------------------------------
From: John Jenkins
To: "'The The'"
Subject: RE: Top 10 albums
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 06:04:15 -0330
Message-Id: <01BABD5B.A761FB80@newcd28.newcomm.net>

Impossible to make a top ten, so here's a baker's dozen of my top fifty, =
in no particular order (assuming that Physical Graffiti, Dark Side of =
the Moon, and the White Album are given...):

Midnight Oil -- Earth and Sun and Moon
Waits, Tom -- Nighthawks at the Diner
Willson-Piper, Marty -- Art Attack
Underworld -- Dubnoheadwithmybassman
World Party -- Goodbye Jumbo
Nits -- Ting
Fatima Mansions -- Lost in the Former West
Prefab Sprout -- Jordan, The Comeback
O'Connor, Sinead -- The Lion and the Cobra
Blue Rodeo -- Five Days in July
Saga -- In Transit
REM -- Murmur
Three Johns -- The World By Storm

- ------------------
John Jenkins
Systems Engineer
PKS/MOF - Hibernia
- ------------------
------------------------------
From: Brian Edmonds
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Top 10 albums
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 21:19:41 -0800
Message-Id: <199511280519.VAA06628@edmonds.home.cs.ubc.ca>

>>>>> "Doug" == Douglas H Walker writes:

Doug> What are the 10 best albums in your opinion other than those
Doug> released by theThe. (We're all fans of his music).

Well, I can really only judge what I like best now. I'll let history
decide what core of the drivel we call music today will last. Regulars
currently in heaviest rotation (order is mostly arbitrary):

1) REM, Monster (Dead Letter Office also recommended)
2) Liz Phair, Whip-smart
3) Mae Moore, Dragonfly
4) Blues Traveler, Four
5) Roxette, Tourism (Crash Boom Bang also popular)
6) Matthew Sweet, Girlfriend (and all the rest too :)
7) Steve Taylor, Squint
8) Macross Plus Soundtrack volume 1
9) Bach, Goldberg Variations
10) U2, Zooropa (recently pushing out Achtung Baby)

Brian. http://www.cs.ubc.ca/spider/edmonds/music/music.html
------------------------------
From: Daniel John MacEachern
To: Brian Edmonds
Cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Top 10 albums
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:30:51 -0400 (AST)
Message-Id:

awwww, after compiling my top ten, I realized that I left out Girlfriend
by Matthew Sweet.


Daniel MacEachern
Halifax, NS
------------------------------
From: Joonas Virtasalo
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Top 10 albums
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 08:23:55 +0200
Message-Id: <199511280625.IAA08200@jazz>

Here's my Top 10 albums: (for now)

1. The Auteurs: New Wave
2. Jane's Addiction: Ritual
3. Dinosaur Jr: Green Mind
4. Alice In Chains: SAP / Jar of Flies compilation
5. REM: Fables of the Reconstruction
6. Dinosaur Jr: Bug
7. Primus: Sailing the Seas of Cheese
8. Cranberries: Everybody Else Is Doing It So Why Can't We?
9. Midnight Oil: Earth & Sun & Moon
10. NITS: Giant, Normal, Dwarf


And to Peter Caira, Dinosaur Jr. is truly a great band!
- -----------------------------------------------------------------------
Joonas Virtasalo, Satakunta Polytechnic, ADP-Department ! !
joonas@jazz.cc.spt.fi, http://www.spt.fi/~joonas ! !
- -----------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
From: Peter Caira
To: Joonas Virtasalo
cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Top 10 albums
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 12:37:47 -0500 (EST)
Message-ID:

On Tue, 28 Nov 1995, Joonas Virtasalo wrote:

> And to Peter Caira, Dinosaur Jr. is truly a great band!

I truly agree...they (he) rocks very hard...

Peter Caira
caira@server.uwindsor.ca
http://supernova.uwindsor.ca/staff/caira

Give me life, give me pain, give me myself again
------------------------------
From: "Mr R. Forster"
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Top 10 albums
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 09:00:33 +0000 (GMT)
Message-Id: <199511280900.JAA07343@chad2-21.liv.ac.uk>

Here's my top ten if anybody is interested :

currently...

Goldie
Tricky - Maxinquaye
Manic Street Preachers - Gold against the soul
Smashing Pumpkins - Siamese dreams
any bowie prior to and ending at scary monsters
Dr Dre - The Chronic
Robert Hood
Rolling Stones -Let it bleed
Funkadelic - Maggot Brain
War - Greatest Hits!!!!






































------------------------------
From: Genepool@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Top 10 albums
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:25:28 -0500
Message-ID: <951128132526_118715163@mail06.mail.aol.com>

1. Nirvana: In Utero
2. Tindersticks: Tindersticks
3. Cure: Faith
4. David Sylvian: Gone to Earth and Rain, Tree, Crow
5. Peter Gabriel: Passion
6. Peter Murphy: Love Hysteria
7. My Bloody Valentine: Loveless
8. Kraftwerk: Radioactivity
9. Brian Eno: Too hard to pick one album
10. Wolfgang Press: Funky little Demons

These are off the top of my head, it could change a few minutes from now!

Steve
*************************************************
genepool is the name of our band
*************************************************
------------------------------
From: Daniel John MacEachern
To: Genepool@aol.com
Cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Top 10 albums
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:50:14 -0400 (AST)
Message-Id:

which one?

Daniel MacEachern
Halifax, NS


On Tue, 28 Nov 1995 Genepool@aol.com wrote:

> 2. Tindersticks: Tindersticks
------------------------------
From: Daniel John MacEachern
Sender: owner-world-soccer@io.com
To: Douglas H Walker
Cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu, thethe-l@io.com
Subject: Re: Top 10 albums
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:19:56 -0400 (AST)
Message-Id:

okay then, here are my top ten

1. The Beatles - The Beatles (white album)
2. U2 - The Joshua Tree
3. R.E.M. - Automatic for the People
4. 54*40 - Dear Dear
5. The Cure - Disintegration
6. The Tragically Hip - Day for Night
7. Pavement - Crooked Rain, Crooked Rain
8. Paul Westerberg - 14 Songs
9. Beastie Boys - Check Your Head
10. Violent Femmes - Add It Up

Daniel MacEachern
Halifax, NS

------------------------------
From: Peter Caira
To: Douglas H Walker
cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu, thethe-l@io.com
Subject: Re: Top 10 albums
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 20:00:54 -0500 (EST)
Message-ID:


Here's my list:

1) Tori Amos - Under the Pink
2) Tori Amos - Little Earthquakes
3) The Kinks - The Kinks are the Village Green Preservation Society
4) Midnight Oil - Earth and Sun and Moon
5) The Kinks - Lola vs. Powerman and the Moneygoround
6) The Tragically Hip - Day For Night
7) Fishbone - The Reality of My Surroundings
8) The Rheostatics - Whale Music
9) REM - Life's Rich Pageant
10) The Wonderstuff - Unbearable

Keep in mind that this changes over time...
Honourable mentions are:
Dinosaur Jr - Green Mind,
Weather Report - Black Market
Prince - Contorversy
Talking Heads - More Songs about Buildings and Food
5440 - Smilin' Buddha Cabaret

Peter Caira
caira@server.uwindsor.ca
http://supernova.uwindsor.ca/staff/caira

Give me life, give me pain, give me myself again
------------------------------
From: twalton@e2.empirenet.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Top 10 albums
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 23:34:46 -0800 (PST)
Message-Id: <199511280734.XAA21592@e2.empirenet.com>

Hi people. I thought this seemed like as good an opportunity as any to delurk
so here goes:

My current (emphasis on current) top ten is:

1. Coil -- Love's Secret Domain
2. John Cale -- Fragments of a Rainy Season (this album is incredible I can't
stop listening to it.)
3. Marilyn Manson -- Portrait of an American Family
4. Morphine -- Cure for Pain(or any Morphine for that matter)
5. Pigface -- Gub
6. Jello Biafra -- No More Cocoons (does spoken word count?)
7. Leonard Cohen -- The Best of...
8. Bauhaus -- any Bauhaus album will do they rank right up there with TheThe as one of my all-time favorites.
9. Sages of Memphis -- Jewel (thought I'd put in a plug for a local band :)
10. Bad Religion -- Generator

some honorable mentions include:

Skinny Puppy, Sisters of Mercy, NIN, Diamanda Galas, Foetus, Tom Waits,
This Mortal Coil, and countless others...as you can see I can't really nail down
ten favorites.

------------------------------
From: marice@students.wisc.edu (elvis)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Top 10 albums
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 13:09:12 -0600
Message-Id:


>3. Cure: Faith

kind of funny, but i just gave this album another listen a few days ago,
and was pleasantly surprised....anyone else out there this "funeral" is a
masterpiece?

>These are off the top of my head, it could change a few minutes from now!

so whatever happened to the guy who was getting rid of imports? he hasn't
gotten back to me in forever and i told him i was DEFINITELY
interested...sheesh!

just think cats....nly a few more months till gunsluts!

i hope everyone OD'd on soybean turkey substitutes over
thanksgiving...excepting you foreigners.....you can have some of
mine...just send a self-addressed stamped envelope to the Graceland estate
and i'll be happy to mail you some.
- -elvis

------------------------------
From: marice@students.wisc.edu (elvis)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: top ten
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 1995 19:53:06 -0600
Message-Id: <199511280153.TAA82661@audumla.students.wisc.edu>

so it seems one good turn deserves another...here i am coming to you from
death to impose my music tastes on the lot of you! hah haah!

my current top ten (it fluctuates): minus the The because you obviously all
know they rock!

1. suzanne vega--...enough said...if you even remotely like
suzanne, you SHOULD have this album.

2. sinead o' conner--am i not your girl?...nummy jazz oldies with sinead's
infocking-credible voice

3. morphine--cure for pain..this album is unlike anything i ever used to
listen to...it is original and incredibly moving in a slinky sexy way...

4. jeff buckley--grace...this album is incredible...lyrics "i think much
more than i ought to think, do things i never should do, i drink much more
than i ought to drink because it brings me back you..."...mmm...

5. the afghan whigs--gentlemen...i hated this album when i first hear it,
but i listened to it over and over and realized that the lyrics are
incredibly true in a pig-headed way...the whole album is rocked by emotion
and sexual frustration and life's little pranks it likes to call love...

6. counting crows--august and everything after...laugh it up fuzzballs!
this album remains on my top ten "i want to get me a little oblivion,
baby..try to get myself away from myself and me..."

7. the cure--disintegration...self explanitory

8. hazel--toreador of love...this was a recent purchase, and for those of
you who have never heard of hazel, it's a subpop album. they have
excelltent lyrics, but of course the wonderful, unkempt style that makes
indie KOO-el..

9. sunny day real estate--diary..."sometimes i can't lay down my past.
sometimes i'm too blind to see you laughing at me. altough you hit me hard
i come back sometimes...sometimes...sometimes you drag me on. no words to
explain. although you threw away my name from your mind i have to try.
although my heart is bruised by your words. sometimes..."
lyrics to send a chill up any back....a distinct sound....i've never heard
of anyone not liking this album...anyone who hasn't heard of SDRE; two of
the members of SDRE are in foo fighters now...ACK!

10. frank sinatra--the main event....any other sinatra fans out there?

what's in the changer:
tori amos--little earthquakes
the cranberries--everyone else is doing it so why can't we
portishead--dummy

what's in the tape player:

hah! kevin paez's tape he sent me! hee hee! he is awesome...anyone in the
dallas area should check him out (sorry for posting this publically
kevinmeister, but it rawked)

compilations:

soundtrack to Priscilla queen of the desert: a snappy mix of disco and
fourties jazz...nummy with penut butter on top!

"a means to an end"-tribute to joy division...incredible...


honourable mentions:

shudder to think--pony express record.."tongue kiss through the kitchen
screen"...

pj harvey--four track demos..."you were supposed to be my life....dammit!"

- ------------------
so there you have it...the whole shebang and to anyone who actually read the
whole thing, one HUGE email kiss. yay!
- -elvis
------------------------------
From: bickertonj@mozart.which.co.uk (Sons and Daughters, love and laughter, tears and sadness and happiness.)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Tip Top Ten
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:34:32 +0100
Message-Id: <95112811343264@mozart.which.co.uk>

In keeping with the tradition:

1. MOMUS - pretty much any albumn, pushed into a decision I'd go for
Hippopotamomus
2. Elvis Costello - again, a lot to choose from but I'd probably go for Get
Happy!
3. Lou Reed - pushed to make a one off judgement it would have to be New York
probably. Velvets- Live 1969 double LP.
4. The Beautiful South - B sides collection with compilation LP.
5. Suede - Dog Man Star. Brilliant
6. Blur - Modern Life Is Rubbish.
7. REM - Murmur
8. The Violent Femmes - The Violent Femmes. Can't be beaten.
9. Neil Young - lots of his 'stuff' soft and loud but with my arms twisted
behind my back and a knife to me forced into an uncompromising choice I'd say
'loud' Neil circa Live Rust.
10. Nuggetts compilation double LP or The Misunderstood, 'dirty' 60's guitar
based or cheesy keyboards music.

The the are a top choice also, of course. Burning Blue Soul is probably the
most interesting but I can live with any The the produce and be happy.

Jake.
------------------------------
From: Smitten123@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: TOP 10
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 12:20:14 -0500
Message-ID: <951128122012_118658197@mail04.mail.aol.com>




Wow, my first post since the flame war with Dave H. and his groupies...
(yes, I'm still alive).

- -MY TOP 10- Based on anything, albums to singles, that have most influenced
my music:

1) Meat is Murder by the Smiths
2) Infected by the The
3) 7" single of Controversial subject by the The
4) 17 Seconds by the Cure
5) Faith by the Cure
6) Soul Mining by the The
7) Any Minor Threat release
8) Walk together, rock together by 7 seconds
9) Louder than Bombs by the Smiths
10) Viva Hate by Morrissey

Honorable Mentions:
His 'n' Her's by Pulp
Dusk by the The
Murmur by REM

JaY

PS the new Electrafixion album is ace!





------------------------------
From: Abu Hajj
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Top Ten Albums
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 11:19:46 -0800
Message-Id: <199511281919.LAA09142@envy.ugcs.caltech.edu>

hey!

Strangely enough, despite being an industrial/techno head, the The has
clearly been my favorite band throughout my life. i guess i got hooked
on Soul Mining, and have loved it ever since. Other than the The,
though, my top ten albums of the moment are:

10. Pygmy Children _Deconstruct_
9. Brian Eno _Ambient 4_
8. Lights of Euphoria _Lights of Euphoria_
7. the Prodigy _Jericho_
6. the Grid _Evolver_
5. compilation (Moonshine) _Positive Energy_
4. Aphex Twin _Ventolin_
3. Front 242 _Headhunter_ (the lp 12" single)
2. Autechre _Flutter_ (no repetative beats)
1. KMFDM _Naive_

_
i guess i'm freeke.

i also listen to the Cure a bunch, but it's more flowing background
music than sitting in front of the speakers with the volume cranked.

Anyone else really like slow emotion replay and jealous of youth?

until later - JP
- ----------------
Better living through stuff that doesn't suck
------------------------------
From: marice@students.wisc.edu (elvis)
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Top Ten Albums
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:40:34 -0600
Message-Id: <199511282040.OAA33962@audumla.students.wisc.edu>

>At 3:51 PM 11/28/95, Daniel John MacEachern wrote:
>>slow emotion replay is definitely one of my top 5 songs by any band
>>anywhere, of any time
>
>So is Jealous of Youth, though...
>
>>> Anyone else really like slow emotion replay and jealous of youth?
>>>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>I have the honor to be, sir, your obediant servant.
>
>John Sherman to TF Bayard, April 2, 1885
>
>David Jellinek
>djelline@haverford.edu
>610-642-5511
>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------
to add to this chain, i'd have to say that slow emotion replay is a definite
favorite i wish i could afford the import...maybe i can today! yay!
- -elvis>
>
------------------------------
From: MrT1977@aol.com
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Top Ten Albums
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 11:19:47 -0500
Message-ID: <951129111947_119830342@mail02.mail.aol.com>

> > Anyone else really like slow emotion replay and jealous of youth?


I do , especially Slow Emotion Replay. That is the coolest. Almost as good as
Perfect but not quite. Jealous of youth is good too.


Donnie
------------------------------
From: Patrick Stewart
To: Abu Hajj
Cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Top Ten Albums
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 14:15:19 -0600 (CST)
Message-Id:

While jealous of youth was a favorite when I first heard it, it becomes more
pertinent to me as I get older, and regret more.

Patrick


>
> Anyone else really like slow emotion replay and jealous of youth?
>
> until later - JP
> ----------------
> Better living through stuff that doesn't suck
>
------------------------------
From: Superfly TNT
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Top Ten Albums
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 16:55:38 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id:


ok... I'll take a shot at this task of narrowing my favorite albums to
just ten...

The Beatles - The White Album / Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band
The Clash - London Calling
Dead Kennedys - Frankenchrist
The Cure - The Head on the Door
The Jimi Hendrix Experience - Electric Ladyland
Husker Du - Warehouse: Songs and Stories
The Pixies - Doolittle / Surfer Rosa / Come on Pilgrim
Pavement - Wowee Zowee / Slanted and Echanted
Nirvana - Nevermind
Morrissey - Viva Hate
Mudhoney - Mudhoney
Minutemen - Double Nickels on the Dime
Lou Reed - Transformer / New York
R.E.M. - Murmur
The Smiths - The Queen is Dead
Sonic Youth - Daydream Nation / Dirty
Sugar - Copper Blue / Beaster
Superchunk - No Pocky for Kitty
The Velvet Underground & Nico - s/t
Violent Femmes - Violent Femmes

ok... so it wasn't ten... honourable mentions to Gentlemen by The Afghan
Whigs and Giant Steps by The Boo Radleys...

Yan

oh, also to Dinosaur Jr.'s Where You been...

one more thing, my favorite the The album is Dusk...
------------------------------
From: Daniel John MacEachern
To: Abu Hajj
Cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Top Ten Albums
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:51:48 -0400 (AST)
Message-Id:


slow emotion replay is definitely one of my top 5 songs by any band
anywhere, of any time

Daniel MacEachern
Halifax, NS

>
> Anyone else really like slow emotion replay and jealous of youth?
>
------------------------------
From: Peter Caira
To: Daniel John MacEachern
cc: Abu Hajj , infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Top Ten Albums
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 21:18:51 -0500 (EST)
Message-ID:

On Tue, 28 Nov 1995, Daniel John MacEachern wrote:

> slow emotion replay is definitely one of my top 5 songs by any band
> anywhere, of any time

> > Anyone else really like slow emotion replay and jealous of youth?

I love them both!

Peter Caira
caira@server.uwindsor.ca
http://supernova.uwindsor.ca/staff/caira

Give me life, give me pain, give me myself again
------------------------------
From: Madhatter
To: Abu Hajj
Cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Top Ten Albums
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:01:44 -0500 (EST)
Message-Id:

Here are my top 10 faves (at least, off the top of my head)

1) Meat Is Murder, The Smiths
2) Closer, Joy Division
3) The World Inside, Human Drama (if you haven't heard this one I HIGHLY
recomend it)
4) Trope De Le Monde (spl?????), The Pixies
5) Burning from the Inside, Bauhaus
6) Animals, Pink Floyd
7) Disintigration, Cure
8) Ziggy Stardust, David Bowie
9) Bloodletting, Concrete Blonde
10) Soundtrack for the Wizard of Oz (and why not?)

------------------------------
From: djelline@haverford.edu (David M. Jellinek)
To: Daniel John MacEachern ,
Abu Hajj
Cc: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Re: Top Ten Albums
Date: Tue, 28 Nov 1995 15:09:34 -0500
Message-Id:

At 3:51 PM 11/28/95, Daniel John MacEachern wrote:
>slow emotion replay is definitely one of my top 5 songs by any band
>anywhere, of any time

So is Jealous of Youth, though...

>> Anyone else really like slow emotion replay and jealous of youth?
>>

- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have the honor to be, sir, your obediant servant.

John Sherman to TF Bayard, April 2, 1885

David Jellinek
djelline@haverford.edu
610-642-5511

------------------------------
From: stk2266@pollux.stockton.edu
Sender: owner-world-soccer@io.com
To: <@thethe.stockton.edu>
Subject: top 10
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 95 12:03:27 EDT
Message-Id: <199511291703.LAA03954@deliverator.io.com>

Here's my list of my top 10 favorite albums. Boy do I feel like a misfit on
this list.
1. LIVE- Mental Jewlery
2. Guns-n-Roses- Appetite for Destruction (still love that glam rock0
3 Blues Traveller - Blues Traveller
4. LIVE - Throwing Copper
5. U2- Joshua Tree
6. Nine Inch Nails- Pretty Hate Machine
7. Black Crowes- Shake your Money Maker
8. Marilyn Manson- Portrait of an American Family
9. Pearl Jam- Ten
10. Blues Traveller- Four
3 thruogh 10 aren't in any order, they're all equal in my opinion.
Honorable mentions:
Pink Floyd- The Wall & Wish you were here
The Offspring - Ignition
Garth Brooks- The Hits
Toad the Wet Sprocket- Fear
Violent Femmes- Violent Femmes
------------------------------
From: "Roderich Heikenfeld"
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Top 10
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 1995 18:50:26 +0100
Message-Id: <30bc9d245508002@sun529.rz.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>

Here=B4s my Top Ten (excluding the The):

1. Massive Attack: Blue lines
2. Massive Attack: Protection
3. U2: Under a blood red sky
4. Seal: Seal
5. Sting: Nothing like the sun...
6. INXS: Listen like thieves
7. The Smiths: Meat is murder
8. Peter Gabriel: So
9. Queen: Innuendo
10. Roachford: Permanent shade of blue
------------------------------
From: "Jan Schneider" <00schnei@HRZ.Uni-Bielefeld.DE>
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu
Subject: Hallo erst mal!
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 02:21:17 +0000
Message-Id: <9511300125.AA05720@hermes.hrz.uni-bielefeld.de>

Hello everybody ...

...from a new member of the Infected Mailing List.
I don't know how often you did discuss this subject, so you got my
stupid question: When Hanky Panky was released I read an article in a
German music magazine where they said that simultanously to the
recording of this (really nice) Hank Williams tribute, Matt Johnson
was already working on his next "real" the The album. It should be
released at the end of this year.
Does anyone know something about it?

Regards, Jan!
------------------------------
From: "M.A.Moynier"
To: infected@cs.uchicago.edu, murt@cycling.org
Subject: Stupid; I know, but hey!
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 1995 10:17:07 GMT0BST
Message-ID:

******************************************************************
Hi. My name is Mary Hansen. I am an 11-year-old sixth-grader
in DeLand, Florida. I am doing a science project that will attempt
to demonstrate the scope and reach of the Internet by gauging
how many messages I can receive in a 24-hour period.

Please send a brief message (even just one word, like "Hi")
to my dad's e-mail account: between
9 a.m. Wednesday, November 29 and 9 a.m., Thursday, November 30
(adjust for your time zone).

I would also very much appreciate it if you could forward THIS
message to as many people and groups as you know online so they
can send me messages, too!

Thank you very, very much,

Mary Hansen

Southwestern Middle School
DeLand, Florida

****************************************
mfzx5mam@stud.man.ac.uk

------- end -------